Bad musket caps or bad striker?

[BigGame]

This is my first muzzleloader. I recently received a new box of musket caps and the first five attempted did not ignite. I had one of those CCI reenactor musket caps handy and it ignited fine in my rifle. Trying to figure out if I have a problem with my striker or with the new musket caps. Thoughts?

Here are the five that did not ignite.

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[Andy54Hawken]

When shooting a percussion muzzle loader its a good idea to "bust a few caps" ...

As in before loading the rifle or musket with powder and ball , place a cap on the nipple and "fire " the rifle or musket.
This will blow out any oil that is barrel or drum that would cause a slow or no ignition.

Point the rifle or musket at the ground in front of you , while you do this , and you will see if your barrel or drum is clear.
Andy

 

[tac]

This is my first muzzleloader. I recently received a new box of musket caps and the first five attempted did not ignite. I had one of those CCI reenactor musket caps handy and it ignited fine in my rifle. Trying to figure out if I have a problem with my striker or with the new musket caps. Thoughts?

Here are the five that did not ignite.

View attachment 860219 View attachment 860220

V.odd looking caps, them.

What brand are they? And when you say 'striker', what do you mean? That's a strange-looking impact mark.....

 

[BigGame]

When shooting a percussion muzzle loader its a good idea to "bust a few caps"

This is a good reminder. I did not do this yesterday at the range, though I did visually inspect the bore and breech plug before loading. So just now I went into the backyard with an empty chamber, taking two of the CCI reenactor caps and two of the caps in question. Both CCI caps ignited fine, but the two caps in question again failed. In the picture below, the CCI are on top (copper) and the caps in question are on bottom (brass). I also noted that the CCI caps seem to fit the nipple well - I can feel a tactile snap as they set into place. The other caps do not snap into place, but they seem firm. After being struck, the firing compound from the mucket caps in question often crumbles into a yellow, course powder.

So is this an issue with the caps, or do you see some potential where my striker or technique could be causing this? Are CCI reenactor caps known to ignite more easily than standard hunting caps?

And when you say 'striker', what do you mean? That's a strange-looking impact mark.

My rifle is a Traditions Vortek Strikerfire Northwest Magnum in .50 cal with a musket cap nipple. It's an inline rig with a removable breech plug.

I'll certainly list the musket cap in question, once I have greater confidence the cap is the problem. Thanks for the help and let me know if you have further thoughts.

 

[Capn Jack]

From the looks of the musket caps and what you say about seating, I wonder if the caps are seating far enough onto the nipple that the ignition charge is being compressed.

 

[tac]

Whoa right there.

As far as I'm concerned, that is.

What I know about modern in-line guns can be written on this full-stop.

Sorry.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

I think the CCI reenactor caps are the way to go...some guns and nipples ( Oh dear ) are picky about caps.
Andy

 

[BigGame]

From the looks of the musket caps and what you say about seating, I wonder if the caps are seating far enough onto the nipple that the ignition charge is being compressed.

Can I do anything about this? Softer placement? Or are you suggesting that these caps and my musket nipple just won't be friends? Is that common?

I think the CCI reenactor caps are the way to go...some guns and nipples ( Oh dear ) are picky about caps.
Andy

I would use the reenactor caps if I thought they would reliably light hunting loads. I gather they're not intended for that, but I'm open to learning differently.

Thanks for the suggestions.

 

[saread]

The CCI caps are not hot enough for hunting loads. Use RWS caps. My guess is that you're not getting a good seat on the nipple. The caps could be junk, I don't know how they've been stored. If you've dry fired the rifle without a cap, the striker can expand the nipple and give you a problem with seating them. Nipples wear out by expanding after a lot of use. Try a new nipple and see where that gets you.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

I would use the reenactor caps if I thought they would reliably light hunting loads. I gather they're not intended for that, but I'm open to learning differently.

I have used CCI reenactor caps with my antique , as in original 1842 Springfield Musket and a 80 grain charge with a .69 Minie Ball bullet....
It worked every time...If I were to hunt with this Musket that would be the load that I would use..

With all that said...
All that really means is what I would do and what worked for my gun.

Load up your rifle with your hunting load..and try a reenactor cap....
While a chore...if it don't ignite , you can pull your load..or use a CO2 dischager to unload your rifle.
Andy

 

[Bon Sauvage]

I don't know jack about your inline rifle. I've never seen your model in the flesh let alone held one.

BUT after reading about ignition problems with your particular rifle dating back to 2012 and knowing that the successful caps that you are using are reenactor caps (weaker for the noise level but still must work to shoot off blanks) I suggest that the problem lies with the rifle and not with the caps.

Perhaps further research on your part will lead you to a different conclusion.

I agree with Andy's recommendation that you test your hunting load with the reenactor cap. Use Holy black to help ensure a proper ignition. If you live on the dry side of Oregon I will gladly donate some powder if required.

 

[BigGame]

Thanks all for the ongoing suggestions. You've given me a number of rifle-specific routes to investigate from replacing a potentially worn musket nipple to scrutinizing the striker mechanism to exploring loads using CCI reenactor caps. I've got my work cut out for me for a bit.

With luck, maybe I can also bump into someone at my local gun range (TCGC) who could test the caps in their own rifle for some added information.

 

[BigGame]

Following up on this thread. I purchased a new musket cap nipple and did a full tear down cleaning of the striker mechanism. That still didn't help. I also got hold of a different package of the same musket caps - still no good. I then managed to get some RWS musket caps and they worked. I was able to successfully fire the rifle four times at the range yesterday.
So I'm thinking my rifle/nipple design is just a bit finicky about which caps it will fire, as was mentioned as a possibility above.

New question: Firing at the range yesterday I ran a treated patch down the bore after each shot. After four shots, I began getting hang fires - the musket cap was not ignited. I suspect I was getting a bunch of gunk back in the striker and it was binding things enough to slow the strike. I took it home and gave it a thorough cleaning again. For those familiar with inline striker designs, is this common that fouling limits you to only a few shots before needing a thorough cleanup?

 

[BigGame]

I should add I was shooting 100gr 777 FFG.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Glad you found some caps that work for the rifle.

While not an inline , nor with Triple 7 ...
I found it not necessary to run a cleaning patch after each shot , or even a series of shots with any of black powder guns , newly made , custom or replica...or antique original.
Please note that I use actual black powder and not a substitute powder.
Just something to consider for you to try.

I post the above , because in my experience with muzzle loaders...both traditional and modern...
substitute BP is far more corrosive and prone to issues , than real black powder.
Andy

 

[EPS]

I had a can of caps that would not work.
I don't know if they got wet or something but it was a new can and i kept trying them only got a few to work.
After about 10 or 15 I just threw the rest away.
And open a new can no problems.
Don't know what it was could have been a bad batch or something.