National ATF: Nobody else can shoot your NFA weapon, even when you are present

[COOPERDB]

HAVING TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING
WHAT IS SAID TO THE ATF'S QUESTION
A LITTLE HELP PLEASE
THANKS

 

[COOPERDB]

HAVING TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING THE REPLY TO THE ATF'S QUESTION - COULD SOMEONE ENLIGHTEN ME THANKS

 

[jamez]

Possession requires transfer of ownership or control.
NOT USE.

While supervised, money, trade, gift or otherwise and the legal use and ownership is not relinquished,
unless the afore mentioned is or the purpose of ownership and transfer of ownership.

NO transfer has accrued under the use clause.

Excellent. What's the source of this? Where does one find the use clause?

 

[COOPERDB]

HAVING TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING THE REPLY
TO THE ATF'S QUESTION
COULD SOMEONE PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME
THANKS

 

[gryghin]

I don't think the ATF will have agents hanging around the range waiting to catch someone. All they have to do is wait for the video folks just have to make of them shooting.

Folks are really dumb with phones.

Wait, did they arrest those Chicago kids with the Glock fun switches from the video?

 

[po18guy]

Selective enforcement.

 

[jamez]

Emailed the NFA@ATF for an official stance on letting others use your NFA weapons while in your presence and this is what I got:

From:	NFA <[email protected]>

You must maintain dominion and control over the firearm at all times. Determining this will vary on a case by case basis.

David

...lol

 

[wired]

Emailed the NFA@ATF for an official stance on letting others use your NFA weapons while in your presence and this is what I got:



...lol

Ah yes, The oracle at Delphi. Vague is always correct.

Basically you have to be there.

 

[jamez]

Ah yes, The oracle at Delphi. Vague is always correct.

Basically you have to be there.

Yea, vague to always leave you guessing.

 

[bcp]

I suggest a name change to Department of Alcohol, Firearms, and Tobacco

Bruce

 

[SavageGerbil]

Another example of how the enforcers view the general population. What they see is how criminals and gangs operate, and see no difference between us and them. Their arrogance and hatred toward law abiding citizens is on full display. If you don't bother to contact your legislator, YOU are complicit in this abuse. https://openstates.org/find_your_legislator/

This scene was about drugs, obviously, but I think it fits here

 

[BluesReds]

HAVING TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING THE REPLY
TO THE ATF'S QUESTION
COULD SOMEONE PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME
THANKS

They ask the ATF if they're wearing level 4 plates.

 

[wired]

In reviewing the ATFs new rule it's a little fuzzy but yeah, you do have to engrave the standard name. City and state. I'll have to mod the FAQ a little.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Emailed the NFA@ATF for an official stance on letting others use your NFA weapons while in your presence and this is what I got:



...lol

There is a rule to follow with government regulatory agencies.

Do not ask questions like this.

If you ask it enough times you will eventually get an answer you don't want to hear. It is especially bad in this current anti-gun and aggressive overreach stance that ATF has currently. The question will get spread around and eventually get to the higher ups. Then it will come down in the form of the worst possible answer which the agency thinks is the "safest" for them. That answer then can even become a directive to the whole organization. It NEVER comes down the other way when it reaches the higher ups. I have seen it happen countless times and it's the private individuals that suffer. All the Fed agency cares about is more funding and avoiding lawsuits they don't care about the impact on people at those higher levels.

I am serious, this is not a joke.

 

[COOPERDB]

They ask the ATF if they're wearing level 4 plates.

THANKS

 

[jamez]

There is a rule to follow with government regulatory agencies.

Do not ask questions like this.

If you ask it enough times you will eventually get an answer you don't want to hear. It is especially bad in this current anti-gun and aggressive overreach stance that ATF has currently. The question will get spread around and eventually get to the higher ups. Then it will come down in the form of the worst possible answer which the agency thinks is the "safest" for them. That answer then can even become a directive to the whole organization. It NEVER comes down the other way when it reaches the higher ups. I have seen it happen countless times and it's the private individuals that suffer. All the Fed agency cares about is more funding and avoiding lawsuits they don't care about the impact on people at those higher levels.

I am serious, this is not a joke.

Considering the question is already on an efile FAQ it's been asked many times already..

 

[jbett98]

It doesn't say transfer though it says receive or possess .. Depending on which outcome I wanted I could argue either way that you do or don't possess the gun when it's handed to you by the registered NFA owner standing a foot away.

And you're right, I've been searching and haven't found any examples of anyone being charged for such an occurrence.. but that doesn't mean they wont try/start now.

Do you own any tax stamped NFA items?

 

[Stomper]

HAVING TROUBLE UNDERSTANDING
WHAT IS SAID TO THE ATF'S QUESTION
A LITTLE HELP PLEASE
THANKS

The retort was, "are those Level IV plates"?

In other worlds, he's implying they better have on some SERIOUS body armor if they want to get any closer….

 

[RedneckRampage]

Emailed the NFA@ATF for an official stance on letting others use your NFA weapons while in your presence and this is what I got:



...lol

You have to stand behind the person shooting it and hold onto it with them, but make sure you have a better grasp on it than them, so you can over power them and control it if needed, at no time can they grip it harder than you, or straight to jail you go. Perk to this, you get a chance to do the JB sniff.

 

[JudoGold]

FFLs can have "Responsible Persons" listed. How it applies with this latest, I can't say. But it is a thing and approval is similar to other licensing / registration.