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I knew this wouldn't be over, not by a long shot. We really need to be careful about celebrating too soon on anything that comes out of the ATF or anywhere else for that matter. As noted above already, the fight is still on. I got this update in my email today:

After 90,000 comments and condemnation from congressional Republicans, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives backed away from its proposal to ban the 5.56 M855 "green tip" ammunition. But congressional Democrats have taken the idea, expanded the breadth of the proposed ammo ban, and run with it. In a letter to the ATF, Democrats encourage the bureau to move fast and use its "existing authority" to limit any rifle cartridge that can be fired from a handgun. Democrats wrote, "We hope that the Bureau will swiftly review comments on the proposed framework and issue a revised proposal that will address the danger posed by handguns that fire 5.56mm and other rifle ammunition." They have introduced legislation in the House to ban the green-tipped rounds, and Rep. Jackie Speier (D-CA) said she would introduced a broader bill to ban even more forms of armor-piercing ammunition. Because cops wear light body armor and there are some unique pistols out there (Thompson Contender pistol chambered in 30-30, anybody?), Democrats are opening the door for potentially banning all center-fire rounds. And the ATF welcomes this lobbying. Its director, B. Todd Jones, said "any 5.56 round" threatens the safety of police officers – a distorted fear if ever there was one.

You can find the original article here: http://patriotpost.us/posts/33860

And this additional note:

Barack Obama's spokesman Josh Earnest promised, "The president's commitment to putting in place common-sense rules that will protect Second Amendment rights, but also prevent those who shouldn't have firearms from getting them, is as strong as ever. I think the president's own personal conviction on this matter has been pretty evident to those who have watched his public comments." Indeed, Obama's contempt for the Second Amendment is painfully evident, and we don't believe for a moment that we've heard the last from him on infringing those rights.

You can find this comment here: http://patriotpost.us/posts/33831

"Common sense rules" = complete ban on all commonly used ammunition. At least he can say he didn't lie when he said he wouldn't come for our guns. He just intended to make them useless. Honestly, when will more people wake up and see the threat they are posing to the average American?

Keep the barrage of emails and calls to all of your elected reps going. We've got to beat them with numbers, pure and simple.
 
My prediction...
I believe the BATF's next move will be to go after all pistols chambered in a rifle caliber. Mainly AR and AK pistols. Our response to them was that M855 is not anymore capable of defeating level 2 body armor than any other rifle round. That basically any rifle round will zip right through level 2 armor, so why single out M855? Since AP rounds for handgun calibers has been outlawed, it just makes sense to me that this will be their countermove.

We saw this happen with the Sig arm brace. Everyone is contacting the BATF asking if it's legal to shoulder their AR and AK pistols using the arm brace. People are telling the BATF that it's almost the same thing as having a SBR so are you SURE it's okay? Well look what happened. All of the sudden it's no longer okay.

Anyone have any pistol lowers for sale?:rolleyes:
 
Its not over. They will back door this ban regardless what the people want.



ATF and Some Democrats Already Looking at Ways to Revive Ban on AR-15 Ammunition
Katie Pavlich | Mar 13, 2015
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Earlier this week the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms announced it would temporarily delay a ban on AR-15 M855 "green tip" ammunition.

"Although ATF endeavored to create a proposal that reflected a good faith interpretation of the law and balanced the interests of law enforcement, industry, and sportsmen, the vast majority of the comments received to date are critical of the framework, and include issues that deserve further study," an ATF press release stated. "Accordingly, ATF will not at this time seek to issue a final framework. After the close of the comment period, ATF will process the comments received, further evaluate the issues raised therein, and provide additional open and transparent process (for example, through additional proposals and opportunities for comment) before proceeding with any framework."

But according to testimony given by ATF Direct B. Todd Jones yesterday to the Senate Appropriations Committee yesterday, the Bureau is already looking at ways to ban the ammunition and went a step further by claiming "all" 5.56 ammunition poses a special a threat to law enforcement. From the Washington Examiner:

In a Senate Appropriations Committee hearing, ATF Director B. Todd Jones said all types of the 5.56 military-style ammo used by shooters pose a threat to police as more people buy the AR-15-style pistols.

"Any 5.56 round" is "a challenge for officer safety," he said. Jones asked lawmakers to help in a review of a 1986 bill written to protect police from so-called "cop killer" rounds that largely exempted rifle ammo like the 5.56 because it has been used by target shooters, not criminals.

His agency's move to ban the 5.56 M855 version was condemned by the National Rifle Association and majorities in the House and Senate and as a result was pulled back though not abandoned. At the hearing Jones said that nearly 90,000 comments on the proposal were received, many negative.

As a result, he said that the ATF will suspend rewriting the "framework" used to exempt armor piercing ammo from sale or use. "It probably isn't going to happen any time soon," he said. Jones also said, "We are not going to move forward."

Meanwhile, Democrats are pushing ATF to move forward with the ban, despite more the majority of the 80,000 comments submitted to the Bureau being opposed to the ban.

Congressional Democrats are pressuring the Obama administration to move ahead "swiftly" with a proposal that would ban a form of armor-piercing ammunition.

In a draft letter first obtained by The Hill, Democrats are urging the director of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) to use his "existing authority" to keep "dangerous ammunition out of our communities."

"We hope that the Bureau will swiftly review comments on the proposed framework and issue a revised proposal that will address the danger posed by handguns that fire 5.56mm and other rifle ammunition," Democrats write in the letter.
Last week more than 200 members of the House, including Republicans and Democrats, sent a letter to ATF opposing the ban on AR-15 M855 "green tip" ammunition. Fifty-two Senators did the same. The head of the Fraternal Order of Police has stated AR-15 "green tip" ammunition doesn't pose a special threat to law enforcement and there is zero evidence to show AR-15 pistols are being used against police.
 
Amid congrats for Capitol Hill pols, ATF still looking at ammo ban

While the National Shooting Sports Foundation today is expressing "profound thanks" to several politicians on Capitol Hill for their "pivotal leadership roles" in helping to at least temporarily sidetrack attempts to ban certain ammunition for AR-15 rifles, there is ample proof this is only a speed bump in the road for the Obama administration.


<broken link removed>
 
This is the second time in several months that the ATF, as an organization, was "surprised" and "received an unprecedented number of comments" on proposed firearms law changes (41P and the M855 lunacy as the most recent examples).

Just how out of touch do you have to be to continue to be surprised this often about things they claim to be "experts" about?

As I've said many times, being called an "expert" these days just means they are a "former spurt" since that's about all the qualifications they seem to have to deserve that title. And aren't we all ex-spurts then (no offense to the test-tube babies among us)?

It's a shame the morons in Congress didn't throw a temper tantrum and lump 41P and the M855 ban into a pile and address it as an end run around rule of law and Congress in particular. Since the ATF appears to have backed away (for now) Congress will go back to their simpleton ways and assume everything is rosy only to have some super secret changes slid through by the ATF while they are in recess. You just can't fix stupid.
 
Posted the following all over the place on Facebook and wherever else I could put it. It was shared dozens of times on Facebook. Feel free to share it yourself:

"You're being lied to by your elected representatives. That should bother you whether you approve of guns or not...

"Rep. Eliot Engel (D-N.Y.) is pushing the Armor Piercing Bullets Act following the Obama administration's decision earlier this week to withdraw a controversial proposal that would restrict 5.56 mm projectiles for M855 cartridges commonly used in AR-15 rifles."

"Armor-piercing rounds like green tips should only be in the hands of military personnel or police officers, period," Engel said. "There is absolutely no compelling argument to be made for anyone else to have access to them."

FACT: M855 "green tips" are not armor piercing rounds. They have a steel core, but are mostly lead. The fact is that M855 ammunition is one of the weakest rifle cartridges available. The military has discontinued its use in combat for this reason. It's now used only for target practice by the military and civilians.

"But the out-of-touch gun industry lobby is fighting tooth and nail to keep cop-killing ammunition on the streets. We need to speak up on behalf of our police officers and say 'stop the madness, '" he added.

FACT: No police officer has ever been killed with the ammunition in question.

Engel's legislation, expected to be introduced Friday, would restrict the sale of the 5.56 mm projectiles, which can can penetrate police body armor.

FACT: ALL RIFLE cartridges will pierce the Kevlar armor worn by police for protection from PISTOL cartridges, even John Wayne's 1894 .30-30 lever action Winchester. The Law Enforcement Officer Protection act outlaws armor piercing PISTOL cartridges. An AR-15 rifle can be made into a pistol, but it's still more than 2 feet long and weighs about 6 pounds. It's not what a crook wants to stick into his belt to go rob a 7-11.

"Deers do not wear body armor," a spokesman for Engel joked. "No, I have never met a deer that walks around in Kevlar."

FACT: M855 "green tip" ammunition is illegal to use for deer hunting in most states because it is so weak, even with the deer NOT wearing armor.

NOTE: If I had a paid spokesman I'd make sure he knew that the plural of "deer" is..."deer", not "deers".

"Even as they pursue legislation, congressional Democrats are also pushing for the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) to move ahead with restrictions on the armor-piercing bullets."

FACT: M855 does not meet the ATF's own definition of "armor piercing", and it's stretching the truth to say it's a pistol cartridge.

FACT: The 5.56mm cartridge is the one on the left. On the right is a typical deer hunting cartridge."

223-308.jpg
 
Don't get complacent, we must continue to fight this infringement. Contact your reps, keep the pressure on these bastards.

McHenry Acts To Thwart Obama Admin Attempts To Ban Common Rifle Ammo
Posted by Bob Owens on March 16, 2015 at 2:24 pm
Congress and the NRA are not taking the Obama Administration's threats to the nation's ammunition supply lying down, and are instead firing back to protect all rifle ammunition for ATF overreach and abuse.

Here's the text of the press release, followed by some analysis.

Today, Chief Deputy Whip Patrick McHenry (R, NC-10) introduced H.R. XXXX, the Ammunition and Firearms Protection Act. H.R. XXXX would prevent the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF) from classifying M855 ammunition as armor-piercing and from instituting any ban on the sale and manufacture of ammunition that is intended, marketed, and sold for rifle use.

"The proposed ban is but the latest step in President Obama's assault on our Constitution and Bill of Rights," McHenry said. "While I'm glad the ATF acknowledged the vast public and Congressional outcry against this plan," McHenry continued, "they have still left open the possibility that it could be proposed again in the future and many Congressional Democrats have called for just that. The Ammunition and Firearms Protection Act would put an end to this attack on our Second Amendment by ensuring this popular ammunition used by countless law-abiding American sportsmen remains available and not subject to any future ATF bans."

[Quote from NRA ED Chris Cox]

The M855 ammunition is also known as NATO SS109 ammunition and is commonly used by AR-15 owners for hunting and target-shooting. Last week, the ATF scrapped plans to ban this popular ammunition after public opposition. If passed, this legislation would prevent the ATF from proposing any future bans on ammunition used legally.

On February 13th of this year the ATF first proposed a ban on M855 ammunition as armor-piercing ammunition. On March 4th, House Judiciary Committee Chairman Bob Goodlatte (R, VA-06) sent a letter signed by McHenry and 238 House colleagues raising concerns about the Administration's proposed ban. Following over 80,000 public comments, the ATF announced on March 10th they would rescind their proposed ban while leaving open the possibility of reconsidering the framework in the future.

You'll note that the bill would affect "any ban on the sale and manufacture of ammunition that is intended, marketed, and sold for rifle use," meaning it would not just protect against future attempts to ban M855, but would presumably roll back existing bans on other kinds of rifle ammunition.

This would ensure that any existing surplus of non-Russian 7N6 ammunition could be imported. It's less clear if the dwindling surplus of Russian 7N6 would be affected, as the ban on Russian 7N6 was part of economic sanctions placed on Russia by the White House in response to Russia's support of rebel forces in Ukraine.

The act would also presumably allow the re-importation of the Chinese M43 cartridge. The M43 is the original cartridge for the 7.62×39 AK series of rifles. Featuring a steel core, the M43 was a failure as a military bullet because it was incredible stable, and "ice-picked" through the bodies of enemy soldiers with relatively little damage, mimicking the wounding behavior of a low-powered, non-expanding handgun round. This is irrelevant to American shooters, who merely desire an inexpensive round to shoot at targets.

The bill would also presumably allow the sale and import of actual purpose-designed armor-piercing rifle ammunition. This will no doubt cause anti-gun liberals to breakout their hysterical "blood in the streets" chants again, but the simple fact of the matter is that all centerfire rifle ammunition is already capable of piercing soft body armor worn by police, and modern hard armor in Level III and Level IV defeats most AP rounds developed in the 1990s.

Put another way, allowing ammo erroneously classified as "armor-piercing" thanks to an anti-gun ATF and even real AP ammunition used by the military won't change the risk profile to law enforcement officers or civilians, but may reduce the cost of training ammunition in several common rifle calibers.

That, folks, is what we call a "win-win" situation.
 
Military ammunition (NATO ) is designed to wound not specifically kill so the leftists should be buying that stuff for us LOL
 

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