International At least nine U.S. citizens, including six children, Mexican state of Sonora, were killed in a shooting attack Monday

[SUPER X]

There are more sheep than ever in PNW. A like organization could gain ground quick.

 

[Member 5605]

What I find interesting is that Trump offered support but the Mexican president declined saying "we don't need a war"

If that's not a sign of corruption if anyone needs one. Mexico is already at war with the cartels and by talking to guys born and raised in Mexico here at work, they see things exactly as they are. The corruption is deep from top to bottom and a lot of hands are greased in the process or they die.

Declining any assistance with a problem inside of your own country that you are unable and unwilling to tackle is insanity.

I'm not a fan of sending our troops anywhere to quell an internal problem but the outlet for the drug money is the united states...

Close the border. Dry up the money. The castrate.

 

[Flymph]

People keep insisting to me that Mexico travel is safe...

Yeah, they must be white folks, because every mexican american I talk to says they wouldn't go if they didn't have family there.

 

[Flymph]

What I find interesting is that Trump offered support but the Mexican president declined saying "we don't need a war"

If that's not a sign of corruption if anyone needs one. Mexico is already at war with the cartels and by talking to guys born and raised in Mexico here at work, they see things exactly as they are. The corruption is deep from top to bottom and a lot of hands are greased in the process or they die.

Declining any assistance with a problem inside of your own country that you are unable and unwilling to tackle is insanity.

I'm not a fan of sending our troops anywhere to quell an internal problem but the outlet for the drug money is the united states...

Close the border. Dry up the money. The castrate.

Me and a guy agreed that what mexico needs is a "los Pepes" or Contra type group, in all the ways except arms dealings with Iran...

 

[trevi]

I used to know a lot of 'Ex-Pats's' who retired to or based out of Mexico and Costa Rica where things were cheaper and slower. Not the same anymore. Some are still there as they have been there so long. Costa Rica still seems good.

One thihg you learn quickly as a overseas worker from the USA. The US Embassy does not want you to visit them, you are not welcome. Only when I stated I was just trying to register my passport did they relent. In the Seventies, that was a good Idea as it might help prove you had one should it get stolen at some point, now they can get the dat better and easier from the mainframe.

US Embassies are for Foreign Nationals.

I still keep a passport and even got yhe Passport card (To use in lieu of regular passport in Canada or Mexico only, lot more convenient.) You never know. My wife has used it as proof of citizenship (Very Helpful)

We might have to go back to Korea for a funeral or something, but I have no current desire to leave the States, I have no business anywhere but here.

Some people still do though, you just don't realize how many till a incident like this occurs.

Agreed on the visiting US embassies. They were so rude to me in Moldova. I went to get a visa for travel to Belarus and Russia but nooo, they would not have it. The next day, I went to the Russian embassy and they were nice AF to me. A week later, got my visa!

 

[scarlo]

What I find interesting is that Trump offered support but the Mexican president declined saying "we don't need a war"

Possibly there is something AMLO does not want us to see or learn about...

 

[cmerrell75]

That's a false equivalency if ever there were one.

561 homicides in Chicago in 2018. Mostly gang on gang violence. 745 murders in Sonora 2018, 1566 in Chihuahua in 2017.

Over 30,000 people have been reported missing since 2016. Mexico was the deadliest country not at war for journalists in 2018.

It's estimated that only 1 in 10 crimes are *even reported* in Mexico due to the corruption and lack of trust in authorities.

Let's not forget that the cartels like to abduct and murder as a "show of force" innocents like local students.

These cartels opened fire on a parked SUV. Do you think that they couldn't see, through their sights, the figures of women and kids? Even if they couldn't...they approached the vehicles and finished the job at point blank.

Hell, even in Cancun, they tell the tourists to either stay at the resort or only go to tourist spots. Generic travel is ill advised.

I don't get it - we're drone striking the ever-loving-hell out of the Middle East...yet we don't do anything about this? We've been fighting a "War on Drugs" for how long - one that now comes complete with civilian murder by the enemy? Mexico is too damn corrupt to do anything about this problem. The US asserting itself into Mexico to take care of things would go as unpunished globally as Russia into Crimea - and a significant portion of Mexican and US citizens would probably sleep better at night knowing that the scourge is finally being taken care of.

If by "asserting ourselves" into Mexico you mean sending tens of thousands of troops, then yes that is what it would take, a full invasion of a sovereign nation. I think this would look something like the war in Afghanistan. How would you tell members of the drug cartels from innocent Mexican citizens? Not sure you really thought this one through. While in theory, a safer Mexico, free of drug cartels would make a lot of people feel better, this is not an easy task. Wiping out the cartels via maximum force also does nothing to deal with the reasons why the cartels are there to begin with. Finally, while we have our focus on this next "endless war" China, already our biggest threat, continues to hum along and become and even bigger problem for us to deal with in the future, a problem that will make the cartels look like a band of angry shop lifters.

 

[CRBMoA]

Is there a solution, or even a legitimate alternative, being proposed next above?

Serious question.

 

[slimmer13]

If by "asserting ourselves" into Mexico you mean sending tens of thousands of troops, then yes that is what it would take, a full invasion of a sovereign nation. I think this would look something like the war in Afghanistan. How would you tell members of the drug cartels from innocent Mexican citizens? Not sure you really thought this one through. While in theory, a safer Mexico, free of drug cartels would make a lot of people feel better, this is not an easy task. Wiping out the cartels via maximum force also does nothing to deal with the reasons why the cartels are there to begin with. Finally, while we have our focus on this next "endless war" China, already our biggest threat, continues to hum along and become and even bigger problem for us to deal with in the future, a problem that will make the cartels look like a band of angry shop lifters.

They know full well where the cartels are and how they operate. Look at the recent attempted capture of El Chapos kid. The problem is that they are outgunned. These cartels operate right out in the open with full immunity.

All it would take is a few well placed Cruise missiles to at the least send them scurrying underground and put some fear in them.

Or maybe the president of Mexico's plan "hugs not bullets" will work. I'm no expert.

 

[Pandaz3]

Agreed on the visiting US embassies. They were so rude to me in Moldova. I went to get a visa for travel to Belarus and Russia but nooo, they would not have it. The next day, I went to the Russian embassy and they were nice AF to me. A week later, got my visa!

We had a guy who brought Six cassette tapes into Peru, but on exit he only had four, so he was jailed. We went to the US Embassy for help. No go! Someone said got to the Canadian or British Embassy. We did and the Brits called the US Embassy right away and leaned on them the next day our guy was released at the insistence of the US Embassy, in turn at the insistence of the British Embassy. I did learn two lessons, One is Peru counted the tapes and took it serious. Two Contact another Embassy if the US Embassy won't help

I have been overseas a lot in the or with the US military, but they have few problems, the pure civil world is far different.

 

[trevi]

We had a guy who brought Six cassette tapes into Peru, but on exit he only had four, so he was jailed. We went to the US Embassy for help. No go! Someone said got to the Canadian or British Embassy. We did and the Brits called the US Embassy right away and leaned on them the next day our guy was released at the insistence of the US Embassy, in turn at the insistence of the British Embassy. I did learn two lessons, One is Peru counted the tapes and took it serious. Two Contact another Embassy if the US Embassy won't help

I have been overseas a lot in the or with the US military, but they have few problems, the pure civil world is far different.

Jailed over cassette tapes? Like VHS or music/ voice tapes?! WOW!

 

[Pandaz3]

Jailed over cassette tapes? Like VHS or music/ voice tapes?! WOW!

Yes regular cassette tapes, foreign country, foreign rules.

 

[cmerrell75]

Is there a solution, or even a legitimate alternative, being proposed next above?

Serious question.

As I alluded to in my response, this is complex. I am by no means qualified to come up with a so called "legitimate alternative", but I suspect you are poking at me because I critiqued an idea and offered none of my own. Based on my knowledge, one big step toward removing the incentive for the cartels to operate in Mexico would be to remove the demand for drugs in the U.S. For a long time weed supplied to the U.S. has been the biggest source of income for the cartels. If you remove the need for weed grown somewhere else then that would seem to at least somewhat reduce the demand. We have plenty places to grow it here, we should do that, and then tax the hell out of it, and use the money for something good. That has obviously already begun, and may work for weed, but i'm not advocating for the legalization of heroin, meth, or cocaine, which the cartels also supply to the U.S., so I guess get people to stop using those? I'm not really sure how you do that. Americans do what they want and the war on drugs has succeeded in nothing but filling up prisons.

Legalize everything and let God sort it out?

What's your solution?

 

[rdb241]

What I find interesting is that Trump offered support but the Mexican president declined saying "we don't need a war"

That's because a couple of weeks ago. The Mexican military got there arse shot up by the cartell after the military arrested El Chappo's son. Strict gun control in Mexico but yet the cartell kicked butt. The Mexican Pres. told he military to pull out.

 

[CRBMoA]

As I alluded to in my response, this is complex. I am by no means qualified to come up with a so called "legitimate alternative", but I suspect you are poking at me because I critiqued an idea and offered none of my own. Based on my knowledge, one big step toward removing the incentive for the cartels to operate in Mexico would be to remove the demand for drugs in the U.S. For a long time weed supplied to the U.S. has been the biggest source of income for the cartels. If you remove the need for weed grown somewhere else then that would seem to at least somewhat reduce the demand. We have plenty places to grow it here, we should do that, and then tax the hell out of it, and use the money for something good. That has obviously already begun, and may work for weed, but i'm not advocating for the legalization of heroin, meth, or cocaine, which the cartels also supply to the U.S., so I guess get people to stop using those? I'm not really sure how you do that. Americans do what they want and the war on drugs has succeeded in nothing but filling up prisons.

Legalize everything and let God sort it out?

What's your solution?

I'll bite. I hadn't really thought of a 'solution', but I did throw down, so I should take a swing.

To me, let's start by saying if Mexico won't protect our citizens, and they won't let the US do it, we declare Mexico whatever the official official term for a third world crap hole is and institute a travel ban.

I of course realize that even mentioning the thought inflames immigrants and liberals.

But staying the course of inaction means Imma hafta learn to speak spanglish.

 

[cmerrell75]

I'll bite. I hadn't really thought of a 'solution', but I did throw down, so I should take a swing.

To me, let's start by saying if Mexico won't protect our citizens, and they won't let the US do it, we declare Mexico whatever the official official term for a third world crap hole is and institute a travel ban.

I of course realize that even mentioning the thought inflames immigrants and liberals.

But staying the course of inaction means Imma hafta learn to speak spanglish.

I have a self imposed travel ban to Mexico... My wife is fully on board as well.

 

[bbbass]

Close.
Ma Anand Sheela (as she was known) would also have seminars in Bend and Redmond to work to 'draw' people to the community.
I remember at the time a friend of mine attended one just to learn more about it (and not as a potential recruit)
I remember him telling me while he basically considered the whole thing an act of lunacy he did say She (Sheela) was very 'convincing' and had a lot of 'power' over the people attending.

She doesn't deserve enough of my respect for me to call her by her prefered name. Her birth name is Sheela Ambalal Patel. Other names are Sheela Silverman and Sheela Birnstiel, but she'll always be Ma Puta Rajneeshi to me.

 

[11Charlie]

I have a self imposed travel ban to Mexico... My wife is fully on board as well.

If POTUS put one in place I'm sure Mexico would change there thinking really quick with out the revenue from Americans at the resorts

 

[bbbass]

Legalize everything and let God sort it out?

^^^ Yup. Couple up with getting rid of Narcan so that all the stupid people die out quickly.

 

[mkwerx]

So I found it really unsurprising, but aggravating that some of the stories I've seen on this wanted to paint the victims of this murder as bad guys, some using the head line of "sex cult members killed in cartel violence" others were claiming these were polygamists - as if that was important to the fact that they were ambushed and that women and children were slaughtered.

They'd had issues before because of their outspoken nature - these people were dual citizens, not just Gringos going down and stirring up trouble. It was a hit job, and a sloppy one. There were no men in the convoy - women and children. It doesn't matter IF they were polygamist or not. A lot of articles keep saying they were "members of a fundamentalist Mormon sect, not LDS" - painting the victims in a bad light.

These are the same type of sh!thead "journalists" that called a certain dead terrorist piece of crap an "austere scholar" - same bastards that need shot during the next revolution.

Polygamy should be legal, and shouldn't matter when it comes to a drug cartel murdering people. They eliminated these people because they spoke out against violence and stood up for other community members over water rights. Women and children were targeted here, not able bodied men.

IF the Mexican government won't stand up and put an end to the cartels, then maybe we should be sending A-teams down there in civilian clothes, with non-standard weapons, and just let them have a three month "vacation" and see what happens. The CIA can air drop supplies while they fly over to Columbia on their next drug run...