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Question in title but can I disregard barrel length restrictions for muzzleloaders.

For example can I legally add a stock to a muzzleloader pistol?

Can I legally cut a muzzleloader rifle barrel to less than 16 inches in length?
 
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Question in title but can I disregard barrel length restrictions for muzzleloaders.

For example can I legally add a stock to a muzzleloader pistol?

Can I legally cut a muzzleloader rifle barrel to less than 16 inches in length?
Yep as far as the Feds are concerned you can do as you please with them. Now different states "might" have some problem. As mentioned you can buy stuff mail order.
 
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That's my guess too. Have you seen any commercially available muzzleloading rifles with short rifled barrels?
Yes, don't know if they still sell them but you used to see pistols with a stock made to attach to them. Places like Dixie Gun Works used to sell a lot of this kind of stuff. The Fed's do not care about this stuff which is why you (in most states) can just have it sent to you by mail.
 
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I think article on page 2 and 3 addresses my concerns.



"For purposes of this
subparagraph, the term "antique firearm" shall
not include any weapon which incorporates a
firearm frame or receiver, any firearm which is
converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any
muzzle loading weapon which can be readily
converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing
the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any
combination thereof."



If the CVA Optima line could be readily converted to accept the centerfire CVA Scout barrels then it would be subject to the GCA, NFA, etc?
 
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50cal muzzleloader pistol

1660038282677.png



300 Blackout Pistol
1660038038108.png
 
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The reason the "front stuffers" are exempt from the feds is how the feds define firearm for GCA 68. Search for the wording and the culprit is how to be a firearm it has to have the case for the powder. Now most if not all State laws define it differently which is what causes so much confusion and blatant "bad info" to get passed around. Have lost track of the times I read someone saying they could buy a BP gun and carry it because it was not a "gun". By state law in most if not all, they are still a gun. Many states an air gun is no different legally than a firearm.
Now for the Feds, put a gun together from parts that takes a cartridge? Best make sure it is legal per GCA68
 
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The reason the "front stuffers" are exempt from the feds is how the feds define firearm for GCA 68. Search for the wording and the culprit is how to be a firearm it has to have the case for the powder. Now most if not all State laws define it differently which is what causes so much confusion and blatant "bad info" to get passed around. Have lost track of the times I read someone saying they could buy a BP gun and carry it because it was not a "gun". By state law in most if not all, they are still a gun. Many states an air gun is no different legally than a firearm.
Now for the Feds, put a gun together from parts that takes a cartridge? Best make sure it is legal per GCA68
If you have a chance read the ATF newsletter article I linked to. It looks like changes were made in 1998 to allow more inlines using 209 primers to be exempt but if the muzzleloader can be readily converted by changing barrel, bolt and or breechface to fire a cartridge then the muzzleloader will not be exempt. They listed some examples like Contender but I am concerned the Optima line could be considered "readily" convertible if Scout line barrels can be fitted to the Optima frame. I have not seen evidence that it can be done but the Optima and Scout frames look awfully similar.
 
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If you have a chance read the ATF newsletter article I linked to. It looks like changes were made in 1998 to allow more inlines using 209 primers to be exempt but if the muzzleloader can be readily converted by changing barrel, bolt and or breechface to fire a cartridge then the muzzleloader will not be exempt. They listed some examples like Contender but I am concerned the Optima line could be considered "readily" convertible if Scout line barrels can be fitted to the Optima frame. I have not seen evidence that it can be done but the Optima and Scout frames look awfully similar.
Stuff like this is what I have always called "pushing the line". The same thing happened with the brace when it came out. As soon as they got the "OK" people set out to push the line to the point it was easy to see they were just going to say NO MORE.
 
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If it can fire modern cartridges in a barrel that you can swap onto the frame, then you have to fill out the paperwork like buying any modern gun.

It's not exempt if it can swap out barrels on the gun's frame that can fire modern case cartridges.
 
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I imagine this could be problematic for muzzleloader manufacturers if parts are designed by others to easily convert muzzleloaders to fire cartridges.

Imagine I went into business manufacturing slamfire muzzleloaders. No FFL manufacturing license needed since the muzzleloaders are not firearms. Then my neighbor suggest making slam fire shotgun barrels for the muzzleloading receivers. I decline because I don't want to deal with FFL regs. The neighbor decides to make and sell shotgun barrels that fit my receiver design.

At that point the Feds could come after me with the argument that I am making regulated firearms since they could be readily converted to fire 12ga shells with a barrel swap?

I have plans for a 22lr rifled conversion barrel that will replace the breech plug of my Traditions Pursuit muzzleloader. If it works I would assume that makes my muzzleloader a regulated firearm. If I were to market it, does that make all the other Tradition Pursuit rifles regulated firearms?
 
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After reading the ATF's newsletter that is what I believe as well. All that's left to interpret is what they consider "readily" to mean?
Be careful here. Chances are you would never run afoul of them BUT, they are well know for making up stuff on the fly so to speak. If you are pushing some line and for some reason one takes notice? They can throw charges and its up to you to pay to fight. Chances are its never going to happen but I try to just avoid even getting close with those damn guys.
 
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....they are well know for making up stuff on the fly so to speak.
You mean... like recently charging a guy for owning a forced reset trigger as owning an unlicensed machine gun? Nah... they're required to follow they law... right?? ;)

I have to agree. There is an inherent risk when you're getting into the fringes and interpretations of the rules and classifications. If it's not readily apparent and needs input and clarifications from others... odds are it may be treading in dangerous territory. It may not come back on you, but be fully aware that it certainly could.

I generally error on the side of, "I'm old enough to know better, but young enough to do it anyway."

YMMV 😜
 
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I bought a 44 cal cap and ball stainless revolver from Cabelas shipped to my door.
I bought a 50 cal cap and ball Rifle from Cabelas shipped to my door.
The revolver is as accurate as any Pistol I own.
Pyrodex, or black powder it makes no difference in accuracy.
The 44 revolver is my favorite weapon.
 
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I bought a 44 cal cap and ball stainless revolver from Cabelas shipped to my door.
I bought a 50 cal cap and ball Rifle from Cabelas shipped to my door.
The revolver is as accurate as any Pistol I own.
Pyrodex, or black powder it makes no difference in accuracy.
The 44 revolver is my favorite weapon.
Speaking of that. I believe they make cylinders that allow use of cartridges in some cap and ball revolvers. Would that make the revolver a regulated firearm?


Edit: like these.

 

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