Anywhere in OR or WA to rent a 50 BMG?

[moroza]

Despite no natural shoulder padding, I seem to get a kick out of hard-kicking long guns - unmodified Mosin, 458 Win Mag, hot-loaded 12ga - and now got an itch to try a 50 BMG. Does anyone know of a place in OR or SW WA that rents one?

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[2Wheels4Ever]

You think a mosin kicks hard? I'm not sure you're ready for a 50.



Half kidding with ya.

There used to be one for rent at the arpc machine gun shoots, but unfortunately that's been on hold for the past few years. I'm sure if you make a wtb add here on the forum, someone with a 50 will let you put a few rounds through theirs.

 

[Bam]

Find someone who has one and invite them to a range day. Buy them several cases of beer.

No way in hell I would loan a 10k+ rifle to someone even if I trusted them, nor would I loan a cheap 50 cal rifle to someone.

Bad ammo in any firearm can be a bad day, Bad ammo in a 50 cal can be a really bad day. Scott from Kentucky Ballistics learned the hard way he is one of the luckiest people alive.

 

[ThePostMan]

Despite no natural shoulder padding, I seem to get a kick out of hard-kicking long guns - unmodified Mosin, 458 Win Mag, hot-loaded 12ga - and now got an itch to try a 50 BMG. Does anyone know of a place in OR or SW WA that rents one?

where do you shoot at? I could screw the old original muzzle break back on Windrunner m96 so you could know what a kick is... Beware my nightforce will bite your face.Other than that with my terminator break it kicks less than a 12ga and doesn't hit you with hot gas or a shock wave, now a Barrett semi doesn't really kick, you just get hit with gas and a shock wave off that big angled break.

 

[TTSX]

these things usually have plenty of mass and a big brake to tame the recoil. They're not overbored hunting rifles...

 

[moroza]

I specified "unmodified" to refer specifically to the stamped steel butt plate. I should add that my BMI is about 18 and I've shot it wearing a tank top; as far as I'm concerned, all that's required is holding it right. While kinetic energy and recoil force may not be comparable to a 50, I bet the impulse is actually higher than an M82 with its mass, muzzle brake, recoil spring, and such exotic modern decadence as a pad of rubber.

The 458 kicked a fair bit harder, and I was told by its owner/loaner that I had a sh-t eating grin for the rest of the session.

My shooting range is a few hundred acres of clearcut in Douglas county, halfway between Roseburg and Medford. I'm in Florida for a week (where there are 50 BMG rentals, hence inquiring now in case the answer is "no" and I should find time to visit one of them here), returning via Portland where I visit about monthly.

PM sent.

 

[moroza]

O_O

With all due respect to his injuries and survival, I'm disappointed there wasn't any further information about how that happened and how to prevent it from recurring. What lesson can be learned other than "bad luck happens"? Was it age-related degradation of the powder? A questionable home reload?

 

[ThePostMan]

O_O

With all due respect to his injuries and survival, I'm disappointed there wasn't any further information about how that happened and how to prevent it from recurring. What lesson can be learned other than "bad luck happens"? Was it age-related degradation of the powder? A questionable home reload?

it was a SLAP round which are a whole different beast and they are old.... yeah best to shoot new clean 50 rounds reload or bought.

 

[moroza]

That just refers to the projectile. As best as I can tell, the casing, primer, and powder are no different from a conventional round. Does old powder get hotter somehow? Or is possible the projectile lodged in the barrel and that prevented pressure from releasing?

 

[ThePostMan]

That just refers to the projectile. As best as I can tell, the casing, primer, and powder are no different from a conventional round. Does old powder get hotter somehow? Or is possible the projectile lodged in the barrel and that prevented pressure from releasing?

yes and projectiles matter a lot with pressure seating depth etc. Powder varies greatly with time, temps etc... it is a chemical compound bonds can break overtime making things less stable, introduction of moisture can make new bonds and make things less stable. so in short old big rounds like 50 can be very dangerous old .22lr shells whatever

 

[moroza]

Came to find range recommendations, ended up with a subject to research. Considering most of the ammo I shoot through the Mosin is older than I am, older than the SLAP rounds' existence, and in some cases approaching the age of the gun itself, I'm going to look into this matter of old powder.

 

[CLT65]

I shot a big fifty for the first time recently, exactly one round. A guy at the range was trying out his new rifle and offered me the opportunity to fire a round. Helluva nice guy, much appreciated.

It was a single shot Barret, very heavy with a big brake. It felt like a stick of dynamite going off in my hands, but recoil really wasn't bad at all, probably less actual felt recoil than a Mosin-Nagant, but a very different experience.

It made me think of the bed-wetting reporter a couple years ago who wrote an article about shooting the big, bad AR15 at a range, and how firing one round scared him and left him with PTSD. If there was any truth to that at all, firing a big fifty would leave him in a puddle on the floor in the fetal position, whimpering and sucking his thumb.

 

[oremike]

The 50 I got to shoot once had spade grips and was belt fed, recoil wasn't bad at all.

 

[Jason999]

O_O

With all due respect to his injuries and survival, I'm disappointed there wasn't any further information about how that happened and how to prevent it from recurring. What lesson can be learned other than "bad luck happens"? Was it age-related degradation of the powder? A questionable home reload?

Didn't Serbu himself prove on a video that the Kentucky Ballistics guy must have loaded at least a 270% overload, hydraulically pressed to fit in the case. That's an insanely hot round.

Deshields originally claimed it was a stock round, then that it was "tampered with" and finally it came out that it was something that HE loaded.... screw Deshields, he did something unsafe and paid the price.

My brother in law actually owns an RN-50, he shoots old military surplus with no issue.

 

[gmerkt]

The .50 SLAP cartridge is only recommended by the military for firing in machine guns. They prohibit the SLAP round from being fired in sniper rifles. It's in the technical literature for all and sundry to read. Possible issues with chamber profile and/or plastic debris from the sabot carrier. This may be why the Kentucky Ballistics guy had problems, and may have nothing to do with age of propellant.

 

[moroza]

Didn't Serbu himself prove on a video that the Kentucky Ballistics guy must have loaded at least a 270% overload, hydraulically pressed to fit in the case. That's an insanely hot round.

Deshields originally claimed it was a stock round, then that it was "tampered with" and finally it came out that it was something that HE loaded.... screw Deshields, he did something unsafe and paid the price.

My brother in law actually owns an RN-50, he shoots old military surplus with no issue.

The lack of in-depth failure analysis seems odd per se, and given this suggestion that it was his own load (do you have a source?), it smells fishy for the same reason the JFK assassination did - namely, that a bona fide victim (the guy in the video, or the US government in the analogous case) would be reasonably expected to express an awful lot more interest in understanding how TF that happened to make sure it never does again.

The 50 I got to shoot once had spade grips and was belt fed, recoil wasn't bad at all.

If it's the obvious, it also weighed more than I do. I'd love to make some noise with one someday.

The .50 SLAP cartridge is only recommended by the military for firing in machine guns. They prohibit the SLAP round from being fired in sniper rifles. It's in the technical literature for all and sundry to read. Possible issues with chamber profile and/or plastic debris from the sabot carrier. This may be why the Kentucky Ballistics guy had problems, and may have nothing to do with age of propellant.

I read about that too, and fail to see how sabot chunks flying into spotters or magazine feeding issues are relevant here.

Question 1: are chamber pressure ratings affected by the gun's ability to relieve said pressure? If a barrel were welded shut and there were no projectile, would a chamber be expected to hold up to the powder charge?

Question 2: why are cases sized such that it's even possible to fit much more powder than the round needs?

Question/conjecture 3: from what I remember of chemistry and thermodynamics, it should be impossible for a given quantity of a given compound to gain chemical potential energy over time, assuming it's inert with respect to its container. It feels like that would violate entropy. Can someone confirm or deny?

 

[moroza]

-duplicate-

 

[Jason999]

Moroza, I'm basing this off several of Serbus videos, one of AgrippaKC and Backyard Ballistics showing the math.

Serbu showed the rn-50 that failed, only the back half of the breech threads were sheared off. The threads in the breech cap weren't. There was a case head separation caused by a failure to fully screw down the breech cap.

AgrippaKC has shown in his videos that the round that blew up, that was filmed before use, was NOT a surplus SLAP round. But a home load that used a fake SLAP projectile. The sabot on it had NO pre cuts, like all REAL slaps have. Couple that with the fact that it has NO crimp marks on the neck.

And finally since Deshields has made his own compressed loads in the past.... (yet swears, despite the evidence, that this wasn't one of them).

Overly hot reloaded ammo and failure to fully screw down the breech cap was the cause.

 

[ThePostMan]

The lack of in-depth failure analysis seems odd per se, and given this suggestion that it was his own load (do you have a source?), it smells fishy for the same reason the JFK assassination did - namely, that a bona fide victim (the guy in the video, or the US government in the analogous case) would be reasonably expected to express an awful lot more interest in understanding how TF that happened to make sure it never does again.


If it's the obvious, it also weighed more than I do. I'd love to make some noise with one someday.


I read about that too, and fail to see how sabot chunks flying into spotters or magazine feeding issues are relevant here.

Question 1: are chamber pressure ratings affected by the gun's ability to relieve said pressure? If a barrel were welded shut and there were no projectile, would a chamber be expected to hold up to the powder charge?

Question 2: why are cases sized such that it's even possible to fit much more powder than the round needs?

Question/conjecture 3: from what I remember of chemistry and thermodynamics, it should be impossible for a given quantity of a given compound to gain chemical potential energy over time, assuming it's inert with respect to its container. It feels like that would violate entropy. Can someone confirm or deny?

answer to 3: It can become more volatile over time if fully sealed from heat and freeze thaw etc, with that being said if moisture is introduced it can change the compound. Like old compounds in the chem lab sitting on the shelf get water in them form crystals change structure and you get basically a bomb sitting on the shelf that will explode if the bottle experiences shock. very real very dangerous

 

[moroza]

Volatility is a measure of how readily something evaporates; it has little to do with combustion and nothing to do with potential energy per se.