Anyone has jamming issues with Henry 45-70 w/ +P Loads

[ddjchemist]

Today I was shooting 4 rounds of Grizzly 460 gr +P ammo with my Henry 45-70 Lever Action and the rifle had a hard time ejecting empty shells. Loading and shooting was smooth, but to eject each empty shell I had to pull the lever really hard and do it multiple times. Any other ammo that I shot with this rifle ejected with no issues. In fact, after shooting +P ammo, I shot 16 more rounds of regular factory ammo and did not have any issues. Interestingly, when I got this rifle new 6 month ago I shot few rounds of the same +P load and the rifle was ejecting better (just slight bump when pulling the lever) +P loads when it was new than now. Has anyone experienced this issue with +P loads?

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[ddjchemist]

I am trying to find out the max pressure for my Henry and also to find out what pressure is generated by these hot +P loads. I am wondering if these loads are producing pressure too high for the rifle.

 

[dangerranger60]

So examine the empty brass. You should get a clue from the pull marks as to where its hanging up in the chamber. If its all the way around the ammo may be too hot for this gun. if the pull marks are up near the case mouth measure that the case is not too long. Also look at the primers and case head for flattening.
You are a braver man than I am! Shooting +p ammo out of a light carbine does not sound like fun.
After a couple of shoulder surgery's I have given up on the big kickers! I traded 300 Win Mag and 7mm Rem Mag for 6.5x55 Mauser, and 30-30! DR

 

[ddjchemist]

So examine the empty brass. You should get a clue from the pull marks as to where its hanging up in the chamber. If its all the way around the ammo may be too hot for this gun. if the pull marks are up near the case mouth measure that the case is not too long. Also look at the primers and case head for flattening.
You are a braver man than I am! Shooting +p ammo out of a light carbine does not sound like fun.
After a couple of shoulder surgery's I have given up on the big kickers! I traded 300 Win Mag and 7mm Rem Mag for 6.5x55 Mauser, and 30-30! DR

Thank you so much for your reply. I usually shoot just regular loads and do not have any issues with recoil. +P loads are very heavy on my shoulder, but since this summer I will be in Alaska on a backpacking/hiking trip, so I need to practice a little bit hot loads (bear protection). After a round of 4 shots, I am done shooting them since my shoulder starts complaining (I also had a shoulder injury years ago and my right-shooting shoulder is not as strong as it used to be before the injury).
Here I posted a picture of empty shells. Notice some black dented stains on the shells. I also inspected regular load empty shells that I shot after +P loads and they are all clean. I just cleaned the rifle and I noticed too much black gunk inside receiver and around the bolt.

 

[Mark W.]

That looks like a dirty chamber to me.

 

[Bon Sauvage]

I think that Mark W. is spot on.

 

[ddjchemist]

Dirty chamber does not make sense. I shot multiple rounds of Cowboy Action loads after +P loads, and the Cowboy Action empty shells were all clean without those stains.

 

[Mark W.]

Thats because the crap that was in the chamber is now impressed into the +P casings

 

[spider]

If that rifle gives you a harder time, I'll buy it.

 

[ddjchemist]

No way I would sell it. It shoots great, it is very accurate and smooth with all ammo except +P.

 

[deadeye]

Well when I was loading for this caliber I had a Marlin guide gun and the higher loads were not recommended for winchester other than the 1886 or most other lever actions. The loads were for marlin 95's, sharps, or other single shots in good condition. These were the 300gr hollow points I loaded with 43gr IMR 4198 @1940fps and 300gr with 63.5gr H335 @2150fps. The others were 400gr sp with 56gr H335 which wasnt even max but still packed a wallop.
Your rifle I don't think is built strong enough for the plus ammo and the extractor is having problems holding on to extract the overly fire formed brass. I would recommend reading the owners manual and see if they recommend using the higher pressure stuff.

EDIT: After seeing 460gr @1800fps on their (grizzly) site I would say that is most likely over pressure for your rifle and really meant for single shots like a sharps or similar.

 

[ddjchemist]

Well when I was loading for this caliber I had a Marlin guide gun and the higher loads were not recommended for winchester other than the 1886 or most other lever actions. The loads were for marlin 95's, sharps, or other single shots in good condition. These were the 300gr hollow points I loaded with 43gr IMR 4198 @1940fps and 300gr with 63.5gr H335 @2150fps. The others were 400gr sp with 56gr H335 which wasnt even max but still packed a wallop.
Your rifle I don't think is built strong enough for the plus ammo and the extractor is having problems holding on to extract the overly fire formed brass. I would recommend reading the owners manual and see if they recommend using the higher pressure stuff.

EDIT: After seeing 460gr @1800fps on their (grizzly) site I would say that is most likely over pressure for your rifle and really meant for single shots like a sharps or similar.

I think you are correct. It is most likely overpressure in the chamber from +P loads. I did read the manual multiple times and could not find much info about max rifle internal pressure. Some internet sources claim 28,000 psi (~1867 Barrs), some claim it is higher. Anyway, I will avoid using these +P loads and shoot just regular loads. These +P loads are overkill anyway. They do sound "sexy" like an artillery shell.

 

[Member 5605]

That looks like a dirty chamber to me.

This. 100%. Those embedded particles aren't promising.

 

[AK0perator47]

Use this one

DANGEROUS GAME 45-70 GVT MAGNUM - Mono-Metal

DANGEROUS GAME 45-70 GVT MAGNUM - Mono-Metal. Lead-Free. Field Proven rifle and gun ammo. Maximum firepower bullets. Best ammunition for rifles and guns for sale. Buffalo Bore. Strictly big bore. Strictly Business. BUFFALO-BARNES

www.buffalobore.com

Or this one

45-70 Magnum - Lever Gun Rifle & Gun Ammunition

45-70 Magnum - Lever Gun Field Proven rifle and gun ammo. Maximum firepower bullets. Best ammunition for rifles and guns for sale. Buffalo Bore. Strictly big bore. Strictly Business.

www.buffalobore.com

Even the Hornady Leverolution is not going to give you problems

 

[dangerranger60]

That is debris in your chamber. It could be from jerking on the lever to get the last round out. or it could have been on the rounds before they were fed in. I would be most interested in seeing the case head and primer also.
I grew up shooting a Marlin 95 with a 26" barrel. The standard load was 405 gr either cast lead or jacketed. These were loaded at around 1500 fps. I never had any animal spit one back at me!
When the Guide gun came out I could not wait to get one. I also ordered a couple boxes of 400 gr ammo loaded to around 1900 fps. That combo of light gun and ammo kicked like a wicked mule! I could not believe the difference! No one I knew would shoot that thing more than once!
Hers a load Bufalo Bore says will work in Henry rifles.

45-70 Magnum - Lever Gun Rifle & Gun Ammunition

45-70 Magnum - Lever Gun Field Proven rifle and gun ammo. Maximum firepower bullets. Best ammunition for rifles and guns for sale. Buffalo Bore. Strictly big bore. Strictly Business.

www.buffalobore.com

405 gr bullet at about 2000 fps. It is still going to be hot. But like the older load at 1500 fps I have never seen any animal spit one back at the shooter! DR

 

[ddjchemist]

I got a good supply of Black Hills Cowboy Action and Federal Fusion and they should last me for a while.

 

[dangerranger60]

This used to be the Gold Standard for 45-70.

Remington Core-Lokt 45-70 Government Ammo 405 Grain Reduced Pressure

The classic "Green-box" ammunition that shooters and hunters have trusted for years. Remington makes ammunition for nearly every need. This...

www.midwayusa.com

Not too fast ,did not recoil too much, could be fired in any safe gun.
Your gun will shoot faster ammo though! Good Luck DR

 

[orygun]

This used to be the Gold Standard for 45-70.

Remington Core-Lokt 45-70 Government Ammo 405 Grain Reduced Pressure

The classic "Green-box" ammunition that shooters and hunters have trusted for years. Remington makes ammunition for nearly every need. This...

www.midwayusa.com

Not too fast ,did not recoil too much, could be fired in any safe gun.
Your gun will shoot faster ammo though! Good Luck DR

This is exactly where all of my 45-70 brass came from.

 

[ddjchemist]

Tough to find Remington 45-70. Someone else recommended that ammo, but I was not able to find any.

 

[orygun]

Not easy to find any ammo right about now.