Advise needed, traveling to Califonia CCW laws...

[fd15k]

According to the sites I can take my 30 rd mags but they must be disassembled while in CA, AR's need to be locked in a case out of the passenger area.

I don't plan on concealed carry as I previously posted, I know my WA CPL and OR CCW are not any good there.

There are 2 separate approaches depending on whether you're relying on FOPA or not. FOPA is known to have flaws anyway, so let's go for the second one.

California does not require for normal (non-AW) Long Guns to be locked away. Federal law requires for long guns to be locked in a container or
a rack for school zones, but California School Zones only affect handguns. Not required for general transportation.

You got it right for the mags - remove the floor plate, and they become parts kits. No constructive possession for high-cap mags.

For AR's, if you don't intend making them CA-compliant, just detach upper from the lower. No constructive possession for Assault Weapons. However, that only goes for AR's that are not specifically listed on Roberti-Roos AW list.

As usual, this is not a legal advice. Double-check all the information for example here : <broken link removed> .

 

[fd15k]

Your best chance to be able to have a ccw in Kalifornia is if you can get Northern Cali to become a separate state and get your family to move up there. It'd be much easier than going to Southern Cali in hopes of CCW.

San Bernardino County (just 50 miles from the beach, or 20 miles from Los Angeles City) readily issues CCW permits to regular citizens. Satisfy the residency requirements there, and you can have your permit

 

[XSubSailor]

LEOSA act. LE only, not military. Current and retired (with card) LE only.

A couple random thoughts here. I travel to CA to see family on occasion. I carry. And I will tell you, even within the full bounds of the law, it is a risk. Albeit wildly slight. I am certain that every officer / deputy is not aware of the Federal provisions that grants LE the right to carry. And I don't want to be the one that they learn on. Very, very, very unlikely as I honestly can't see myself having any contact with another officer other than for a traffic ticket.

What's the real risk of carrying in CA? I can't imagine a scenario (outside of legit self-defense) where a squared-away, law abiding citizen, on vacation with their family would be subject to a person search. So the risk of getting caught seems about the same as getting struck by lightning. What is the risk of getting involved in a violent crime? The answer to that can vary.

But a man tasked with keeping his family safe must weigh the risks against the rewards.

I believe pepper spray is generally available in CA.

As always, check you local laws, internet advice is worth what you pay for it, caveat emptor, etc., etc.. ad infinitum.

I might add that if you ARE discovered carrying illegally in CA, you will be guilty of a felony misdemeanor and will lose your LEGAL right to carry ANYWHERE in the US.

A simple traffic violation could get you into a position where you are asked by the LEO if you are carrying a weapon...if you lie and he finds out by frisking you or happens to see it, that's just a few more strikes against you, and the family you hope to be protecting, will be instead filling out forms to put up your house as collateral at Jose's Bail Bonds.

I'm in CA currently on business. When forced to travel to the PRK, I just ramp up my situational awareness a couple notches to avoid any unpleasantness that would require me to draw a pistol and keep a small edged weapon on my person just in case.

Food for thought....

 

[mjbskwim]

Make sure that 'small edged weapon isn't longer than the cop's palm is wide.
4" is what is good,but the kid says they usually don't care if you ain't stupid.

 

[fd15k]

I might add that if you ARE discovered carrying illegally in CA, you will be guilty of a felony misdemeanor and will lose your LEGAL right to carry ANYWHERE in the US.

A simple traffic violation could get you into a position where you are asked by the LEO if you are carrying a weapon...if you lie and he finds out by frisking you or happens to see it, that's just a few more strikes against you, and the family you hope to be protecting, will be instead filling out forms to put up your house as collateral at Jose's Bail Bonds.

I'm in CA currently on business. When forced to travel to the PRK, I just ramp up my situational awareness a couple notches to avoid any unpleasantness that would require me to draw a pistol and keep a small edged weapon on my person just in case.

Food for thought....

"felony misdemeanor" caught my eye... what's that ? There actually would be two charges - loaded firearm (P.C. 12031) which is a misdemeanor, and concealed firearm (P.C. 12025) which is misdemeanor if the firearm is registered to the person in California, otherwise a felony. Note that those are old penal codes, and California just had a PC renumbering.

Be careful with the "small edged weapons". Concealed carrying of a dirk or dagger is illegal in California (that includes screwdrivers, if they can prove the intent). Various municipalities also have restrictions on knife lengths.

 

[RickD427]

"felony misdemeanor" caught my eye... what's that ? There actually would be two charges - loaded firearm (P.C. 12031) which is a misdemeanor, and concealed firearm (P.C. 12025) which is misdemeanor if the firearm is registered to the person in California, otherwise a felony. Note that those are old penal codes, and California just had a PC renumbering.

Be careful with the "small edged weapons". Concealed carrying of a dirk or dagger is illegal in California (that includes screwdrivers, if they can prove the intent). Various municipalities also have restrictions on knife lengths.

California defines certain crimes as "Wobblers". Those are crimes that start out as felonies at the time of arrest, but where the prosecuting attorney or court has the option of reducing the charge to a misdemeanor. Some folks like to think that a "Wobbler" is a lesser crime than a felony, but that's not really true. A "Wobbler" is a felony, and nothing less than a felony, right up to the moment that it "Wobbles", then its a misdemeanor, and nothing more than a misdemeanor. The problem for the offender is that there is no assurance that it will "Wobble".

In California, a first offense for CCW or for carrying a loaded firearm is a felony if the firearm is not registered to the offender in the state DOJ's database. That charge can "Wobble" to a misdemeanor.

 

[SonicBlue03]

If you're choosing the Cali route because you'll be able to maintain a higher speed and shave off about 3-4 hours from the trip, ask yourself if the stress you're creating for yourself is worth it vs. an alternate route that allows you to bypass Cali altogether. There's a much nicer, more scenic route through central Oregon that cuts you into Nevada and you never have to cross into California once.

So you can either gamble in Vegas or you can gamble in Cali. Dealer's choice.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Stay home and save your money, I have been doing so for 21 years now

 

[fd15k]

California defines certain crimes as "Wobblers". Those are crimes that start out as felonies at the time of arrest, but where the prosecuting attorney or court has the option of reducing the charge to a misdemeanor. Some folks like to think that a "Wobbler" is a lesser crime than a felony, but that's not really true. A "Wobbler" is a felony, and nothing less than a felony, right up to the moment that it "Wobbles", then its a misdemeanor, and nothing more than a misdemeanor. The problem for the offender is that there is no assurance that it will "Wobble".

In California, a first offense for CCW or for carrying a loaded firearm is a felony if the firearm is not registered to the offender in the state DOJ's database. That charge can "Wobble" to a misdemeanor.

My understanding of a "wobbler" is that the charges are filed (or reduced) at the discretion of a prosecutor or a judge. In this case though, charges depend on circumstances, thus I don't see it being a "wobbler". I might be wrong of course

 

[Z-PDX]

A simple traffic violation could get you into a position where you are asked by the LEO if you are carrying a weapon...if you lie and he finds out by frisking you...

With all due respect (I thank you for your Naval service) and with the caveat that legal advice is worth what you pay for it...

There is a LONG way to go from a simple traffic violation to a "frisk". I am going to get crazy here and by "frisk" assume that you mean a Terry stop. The standard for a Terry stop is that the officer must have reasonable suspicion that the person is both armed and dangerous.

Concerns about the results of getting caught are valid. The odds of an otherwise law-abiding citizen getting caught seem infinitesimal.

 

[fd15k]

There is a LONG way to go from a simple traffic violation to a "frisk".

Not only that, but it's also not a crime to lie to a police officer (non-federal) in California outside the scope of investigation. Not sure what "strikes" could those be.

Concerns about the results of getting caught are valid. The odds of an otherwise law-abiding citizen getting caught seem infinitesimal.

I'm not sure most law-abiding citizens can handle themselves in front of a police officer while committing a serious crime. Better not attempt it

 

[deen_ad]

If you're choosing the Cali route because you'll be able to maintain a higher speed and shave off about 3-4 hours from the trip, ask yourself if the stress you're creating for yourself is worth it vs. an alternate route that allows you to bypass Cali altogether. There's a much nicer, more scenic route through central Oregon that cuts you into Nevada and you never have to cross into California once.

Nope, we have friends in CA that we want to visit before going on to AZ for an RV rally. We will be traveling in a large motorhome towing a car. I have two safes in the motorhome (one regular one and a handgun one) and a third handgun one in the car, plus I can store long gun cases in the underbody storage bays while in CA. If we weren't stopping in CA for a couple days I wouldn't worry so much, but that does negate the safe travel laws.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

With all due respect (I thank you for your Naval service) and with the caveat that legal advice is worth what you pay for it...

There is a LONG way to go from a simple traffic violation to a "frisk". I am going to get crazy here and by "frisk" assume that you mean a Terry stop. The standard for a Terry stop is that the officer must have reasonable suspicion that the person is both armed and dangerous.

Concerns about the results of getting caught are valid. The odds of an otherwise law-abiding citizen getting caught seem infinitesimal.

In a state that has drunk driving roadblocks where they force you to wait in line and then roll your window down and be interrogated, and where at such stops gun owners HAVE been targeted for harassment and searches when an NRA sticker or gun rack or something else was spotted, , where they have gun bans and little CCW, where many of the cops are outright a$$wipes and hoplophobes (as far as citizens are concerned) I would not stand on assumptions that you will not be randomly searched. The place is a virtual police state in the cities and one reason we got out. If any of you have any sense you will not bring any banned weapon or magazine there for any reason, assuming you are determined to go

 

[fd15k]

In a state that has drunk driving roadblocks where they force you to wait in line and then roll your window down and be interrogated, and where at such stops gun owners HAVE been targeted for harassment and searches when an NRA sticker or gun rack or something else was spotted, , where they have gun bans and little CCW, where many of the cops are outright a$$wipes and hoplophobes (as far as citizens are concerned) I would not stand on assumptions that you will not be randomly searched. The place is a virtual police state in the cities and one reason we got out. If any of you have any sense you will not bring any banned weapon or magazine there for any reason, assuming you are determined to go

Please share some stories with us where NRA sticker was a RAS for a search. I lived in SoCal for many years, driving SUV and riding motorcycle with NRA stickers, including to school. Not ever a single cop gave me any attention.

And by the way, DUI checkpoints have been authorized by United States Supreme Court.

 

[rolandson]

If it were me, I'd leave the AR's and anything else that could possibly be considered "assault" weapons, as viewed by the most restrictive viewer (meaning the least sympathetic to you) at home...that would include the magazines that hold more than 10 rounds. Relying upon your interpretation of what is or is not a 'parts kit', may make you feel better; but how you feel isn't going to mean squat to the cop with the mirrored sunglasses as he or she watches you try to explain how that magazine or AR isn't what it looks like.

Just sayin...

From the NRA:
"CALIFORNIA—Caution: California has extensive state and local regulatory schemes over firearms and ammunition. With narrow exceptions, California law generally prohibits the transport or carrying in public (either in a vehicle or on one`s person) of concealed handguns, and the carrying of any loaded firearm. During transport a firearm must generally be unloaded and locked in the vehicle`s trunk or in a locked container in the vehicle other than the utility or glove compartment. Permits to carry concealed or loaded firearms are often difficult to get, particularly in urban areas.

Importation of so-called "assault weapons," .50 BMG rifles, and magazines that hold over ten rounds is heavily regulated and generally prohibited. Possession of an "assault weapon" or .50 BMG rifle is prohibited unless the firearm is registered. Even registered "assault weapons" or .50 BMG rifles may only be transported to and from specified places for specified purposes. A person moving into California must first show "good cause" for a permit to bring these firearms into the state. Permits are rarely issued except for police or for entertainment productions. The general prohibitions on the importation and possession of "assault weapons" and .50 BMG rifles do not apply to nonresidents coming to California to compete at authorized sporting events at authorized venues. Preauthorization from the California Deptartment of Justice in Sacramento for any of these activities is required. For additional information call the Department of Justice Firearms Bureau at (916) 263-4887, or at www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/."

 

[fd15k]

If it were me, I'd leave the AR's and anything else that could possibly be considered "assault" weapons, as viewed by the most restrictive viewer (meaning the least sympathetic to you) at home...that would include the magazines that hold more than 10 rounds. Relying upon your interpretation of what is or is not a 'parts kit', may make you feel better; but how you feel isn't going to mean squat to the cop with the mirrored sunglasses as he or she watches you try to explain how that magazine or AR isn't what it looks like.

Just sayin...

That's a good advice if one doesn't know, or doesn't want to know what's legal or not. Otherwise, I would recommend having contact information for Calguns Foundation - they have a proven track record of getting people out of false arrests related to Assault Weapons.

Defended Bright Spot Pawn from AW charges: <broken link removed>
Defended John Contos from AW charges: <broken link removed>
Defended Don Anderson against AW charges: <broken link removed>
Defended legal AR (Orange County Sheriff Department AR seizure): <broken link removed>

<broken link removed>

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Please share some stories with us where NRA sticker was a RAS for a search. I lived in SoCal for many years, driving SUV and riding motorcycle with NRA stickers, including to school. Not ever a single cop gave me any attention.

And by the way, DUI checkpoints have been authorized by United States Supreme Court.

The USSC is utterly corrupt and 90% of their decisions are clearly invalid

Let me add that they just decided that GPS trackers put on your vehicle are not Constitutional but making you stop on the road and open your window for what amounts to a de-facto, warrantless search with no evidence of wrongdoing is OK? The Founders would be appalled and so am I

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Please share some stories with us where NRA sticker was a RAS for a search. I lived in SoCal for many years, driving SUV and riding motorcycle with NRA stickers, including to school. Not ever a single cop gave me any attention.

And by the way, DUI checkpoints have been authorized by United States Supreme Court.

It was long ago and far away before an internet but I was born there and lived my first 31 years there and was a 2nd amendment activist in Sacramento until we left in 1991. If my word isn't good enough then you'll just have to move along

 

[fd15k]

The USSC is utterly corrupt and 90% of their decisions are clearly invalid

Feel free to start a revolution.

Let me add that they just decided that GPS trackers put on your vehicle are not Constitutional but making you stop on the road and open your window for what amounts to a de-facto, warrantless search with no evidence of wrongdoing is OK? The Founders would be appalled and so am I

I haven't paid much attention to the foot print when I was getting my OR DL, but I bet most states require that you provide identification (DL, car registration) in a traffic stop as a condition of license issuance. If you don't like that, take the transit

It was long ago and far away before an internet but I was born there and lived my first 31 years there and was a 2nd amendment activist in Sacramento until we left in 1991. If my word isn't good enough then you'll just have to move along

And if we go far enough, we had slavery in this nation.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Feel free to start a revolution.

It's imminent and I'll be happy to join in as my ancestors did in 1775 at Lexington and Concord