Advice anyone?

[joeman3285]

Hi Folks
I have a Ruger 77 Hawkeye 30-06(walnut stock) and it's not shooting as well as I want. I bought it off of GunBroker so I don't know it's history but it looks nearly immaculate. So the issues: I put a Leopold on it and took it out and sighted it in but could only shoot 2-3 in groups.... not nearly as good as I want. So last week I free floated the barrel and glass bedded the action (+1.5 inches of the barrel). Seemed like that with the first two three shot groups I had improvement. In the first group the first shot was off to the right of center (5 inches) and the next two were nearly on top of each other but 1.5 inches away from the first shot. Adjusted the scope and shot a nearly identical group but closer to my zero. Adjusted the scope and then it went crazy and couldn't get better then a 3 in group the rest of the night (even with letting the barrel cool significantly between shots).

So what do you think? Forend stock pressure the next thing to try? Ditch the the gun? Different ammo (was shooting fed)? I checked to make sure nothing was loose after the first two shots (bolts and scope mounts etc). I'm stumped. I really like this gun; the cosmetics and action are really nice. Why won't it shoot?

Anyway any opinions?
Thanks!
-joe

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[Swedish K]

Whats the bore and crown look like? A trick some of the old timers used was to mount a jacketed oversize bullet (round nose) in a drill with some polishing or valve grinding paste on it and spin the bullet against the crown to clean up any burrs. I've never tried this method as I always had access to a lathe to re-crown. The trick would be to make sure the alignment is straight.
Other things to consider would be are the optics mounted nice and snug. The inconsistent shots makes me wonder if there is a problem with the optic as well, then again I haven't done much with bolt guns. I'm sure there are others more well versed in this area that will chime in soon....

Good luck!

 

[shockme]

ok ..so got a used rifle , first clean barrel , rely clean it..make sure scope is mounted right squarely ,level ..

 

[oknow]

ok ..so got a used rifle , first clean barrel , rely clean it..make sure scope is mounted right squarely ,level ..

+1 on scope mounting

 

[joeman3285]

Thanks for the input folks. pretty sure the scope is mounted right but I'll check again. It might be that the scope itself is faulty but i bought it brand new.

I'm nor sure but it looks like the rifle may have been already been crowned... I'll look into that as well

thanks!

 

[Greenbug]

Some possibilities:

1. Improper bedding creating action torque, Rugers are tough to bed correctly.

2. Improper action screw torque, overtightening of the middle screw is common. Tighten the forward screw first making sure the recoil lug is properly seated in the stock. Tighten the rear screw second. Then tighten the middle screw last with just enough tension to hold it in place (much less torque than the front and rear screws).

3. Loose scope mounts.

4. Optics problem (probably not the culprit with your Leupold).

5. Fore end of stock imparting pressure on barrel.

6. Damaged or out of square crown on barrel.

7. Inconsistant cheek weld/shooter position in relation to optic.

 

[Darkker]

1) So last week I free floated the barrel and glass bedded the action (+1.5 inches of the barrel).

2) Different ammo (was shooting fed)?

1) So... you free-floated the barrel, only to Un-free-float it with bedding... So your logic being:
Ruger's pressure points don't work, so you will create your own pressure points from an online article???

Some possibilities:

1. Improper bedding creating action torque, Rugers are tough to bed correctly.

2. Improper action screw torque, overtightening of the middle screw is common. Tighten the forward screw first making sure the recoil lug is properly seated in the stock. Tighten the rear screw second. Then tighten the middle screw last with just enough tension to hold it in place (much less torque than the front and rear screws).

3. Loose scope mounts.

4. Optics problem (probably not the culprit with your Leupold).

5. Fore end of stock imparting pressure on barrel.

6. Damaged or out of square crown on barrel.

7. Inconsistant cheek weld/shooter position in relation to optic.

+1

 

[Sgt Nambu]

Switch scopes. If nothing changes then that possibility is eliminated. It's hard to believe but even Leupold could possibly build a flawed scope! Mainly suggest a switch because it is the simplest of tests.

 

[joeman3285]

Some possibilities:

1. Improper bedding creating action torque, Rugers are tough to bed correctly.

2. Improper action screw torque, overtightening of the middle screw is common. Tighten the forward screw first making sure the recoil lug is properly seated in the stock. Tighten the rear screw second. Then tighten the middle screw last with just enough tension to hold it in place (much less torque than the front and rear screws).

3. Loose scope mounts.

4. Optics problem (probably not the culprit with your Leupold).

5. Fore end of stock imparting pressure on barrel.

6. Damaged or out of square crown on barrel.

7. Inconsistant cheek weld/shooter position in relation to optic.

1. Is is possible... I'll do some more research and see.
2. Definitely messed that up. I'll see if following these helps.
3. Scope mounts are definitely secured.
4. I hope not.....
5. No fore end pressure. The barrel is floating free to 1.5 inches of the action.
6. Could be... I'll see if I can eliminate all possibilities first.
7. Again possible but I've been shooting a long time....

1) So... you free-floated the barrel, only to Un-free-float it with bedding... So your logic being:
Ruger's pressure points don't work, so you will create your own pressure points from an online article???

Uh... there was fore end pressure on the barrel and it wasn't centered in the stock.... So i free floated it to 1.5 inches of the action. It obviously wasn't shooting the way it was....

Agree with everyone above, but would include using a copper cleaning solution. My friend had an ott-six with same problem as you. After cleaning with copper solvent 3 times with 30 minutes between to dissolve, he went back to one inch groups.

I'll try that out.

Thanks for the input everyone. Much appreciated!

 

[deadshot2]

Just a short note on proper scope mounting.

Monday, while at the range, I was listening to a shooter complaining that he got erratic groups, some to the left, some to the right.

I asked him if he'd checked the scope mounts. He responded that he'd torqued the ring screws just that morning. I asked if he'd checked the ring cross bolts and the base mounting screws. Long pause then he responded " ah, no. I just assume that the gunsmith that installed the base did it correctly".

I've solved more than one problem rifle by just starting with a bare action top. Install mounts with a small amount of J-B Weld or Devcon to bed them. Torque screws after cleaning well with brake clean and using Loctite. I use a torque wrench for the cross bolts and scope ring caps, using mfr's torque specs.

It's amazing how much better each of those rifles shot when done.

 

[Kurly]

Just a short note on proper scope mounting.

Monday, while at the range, I was listening to a shooter complaining that he got erratic groups, some to the left, some to the right.

I asked him if he'd checked the scope mounts. He responded that he'd torqued the ring screws just that morning. I asked if he'd checked the ring cross bolts and the base mounting screws. Long pause then he responded " ah, no. I just assume that the gunsmith that installed the base did it correctly".

I've solved more than one problem rifle by just starting with a bare action top. Install mounts with a small amount of J-B Weld or Devcon to bed them. Torque screws after cleaning well with brake clean and using Loctite. I use a torque wrench for the cross bolts and scope ring caps, using mfr's torque specs.

It's amazing how much better each of those rifles shot when done.

Agree except for the JB Weld or Devcon under mounts, Dont see that helping if correct QUALITY mounts are being used.

 

[deadshot2]

Agree except for the JB Weld or Devcon under mounts, Dont see that helping if correct QUALITY mounts are being used.

Even the makers of Quality mounts suggest bedding. They can only make the radius on the bottom of the mount to a set of specifications. Not every action's finished dimensions, after polish and heat treat, are the same.

For what it's worth, some who are going for the ultimate in sturdy in scope mounts aren't even using a parting agent (like wax on the action) when bedding the scope mounts. They degrease both action and mount then only apply parting agent to the screws. The bedding will then bond to both. End result, if installing a rail, is close to what one gets when using a BAT or Surgeon action with integral rail. Not quite as solid but close. Have to remove the rail/mount, just heat and smack with a mallet.

 

[YOURSUPREMECOMMANDER]

Even the makers of Quality mounts suggest bedding. They can only make the radius on the bottom of the mount to a set of specifications. Not every action's finished dimensions, after polish and heat treat, are the same.

For what it's worth, some who are going for the ultimate in sturdy in scope mounts aren't even using a parting agent (like wax on the action) when bedding the scope mounts. They degrease both action and mount then only apply parting agent to the screws. The bedding will then bond to both. End result, if installing a rail, is close to what one gets when using a BAT or Surgeon action with integral rail. Not quite as solid but close. Have to remove the rail/mount, just heat and smack with a mallet.

Should I bed my rail with the 5 minute cure or the slow cure JB Weld? What kind of parting agent would you recommend for the screws?