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Active Shooter Engagement Tactics

Discussion in 'Education & Training' started by Raidingtime, Dec 2, 2015.

  1. Raidingtime

    Raidingtime SE Portland Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Hello,

    I'm starting this post to seek out more information on how to best to respond to a specific active shooter(s) scenario.

    Scenario

    Setting: University

    Details:
    - Shots initially heard nearby from within the current location which is within a classroom
    - People can be heard running and screaming as firearm noise increases. It is assumed the shooter is approaching the classroom. Shots heard cannot be determined to be either rifle or pistol rounds.
    - People begin to panic within the classroom

    Defense weapons:
    - chairs/ tables to barricade door
    - 9mm (33 rounds of ammunition)
    - crap and piss in fellow classmates pants

    From here it would be appropriate to inform classmates of the defensive handgun that is about to be brandished and of its defensive intentions.

    Beyond here I have a few procedures that I would follow depending on what else unfolds. However, I am interested in hearing how others would respond to this situation.

    Stay safe and hope for peace :)
     
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  2. MikeE

    MikeE Portland Well-Known Member

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    Here's a good Clint Smith video on Defensive Tactics (full length):
     
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  3. v0lcom13sn0w

    v0lcom13sn0w Keizer, or Well-Known Member

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    once you convice everyone in class that youre the good guy with a gun(good luck) turn out the lights and position people at a hard angle for an active shooter to easily aquire.

    kill or be killed.

    eliminate the threat by any means possible to protect yourself and others.

    im no expert but, if the door opened i would already have my gun out and ready. aim for centermass because if youve ever had buck fever i could only imagine this is going to be way way way harder to keep yourself straight. shoot until the threat is no more. unload your gun, lay down with your hands visible, DO NOT say anything to the police without a lawyer.

    i believe an active shooter would be at a disadvantage to an armed citizen(s) who know where hes coming from(thru the door)
     
  4. 540 Tactical

    540 Tactical Portland, OR When seconds matter...

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    Every situation is different and details matter. That said, the Run, Hide, Fight concept is solid. Good comments above. I would add create choke points in entry but again door feed and classroom layout come into play. As of today, an active school shooter has never breached a locked classroom door. I would imagine that will change at some point as they are becoming more educated on tactics.
     
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  5. Joe13

    Joe13 NW of Vancouver Opinionated & Blunt Bronze Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    I'll take a chapter out of the video gamers basic guide - hide and wait till the other person moves into your line of sight and then shoot.

    Campers/Posters are (or were back when I played a lot on line - I had a young kid, what else is there to do after 7pm without going out :p:D) despised in the gamers circles because it's considered cheating or taking advantage of the "system"; for real world scenarios it is a very wise move IMO.
     
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  6. Koda

    Koda Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    unless someone with some kind of authority asks if anyone has a CCW I wouldn’t give this info out, not in todays anti gun majority it could go the wrong direction as easily as the right.
     
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  7. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I think the hatred is similar as what is felt for snipers on the battle field.
    Builds out of that fear, the fear of what cannot be seen and which can kill.



    The concept of the Ambush is the most basic military engagement. Almost all encounters are ambushes. You are ambushed, you ambush them or you both bump into each other - which is why you want a fun button - he who can bring the most downrange the fastest gains the advantage.

    The challenge of the ambush is forcing your enemy to come to where you want them.

    In a campus setting - business or academia it does not matter - you have some points - door ways / stairways / hallways - which lend themselves to this idea.

    Lock the door, if it can be. Barricade if it cannot.
    Block the windows in the doors, around the doors - tape paper, jackets etc.

    Dont' forget the Red Cans with the White Stuff - Clint advocates for its use and it would be helpful in these situations. As would brooms, umbrellas, sports equipment, books, full soda cans. Think Jackie Chan.

    Don't forget the mass charge - good luck motivating the others present - but if you can, it can be successful.




    * The video gamers hated most of all are those who camp by spawn points and kill before you have a chance to move.





    Share your procedures please.
     
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  8. Medic!

    Medic! What just happened? Has eagle eyes. But cant remember what he saw. Bronze Supporter

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    I think I would grab that beautiful hot girl [You know? The one way out of your league!] and escort her to safety.

    Good tactics don't only apply to shootings. :D
     
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  9. Velzey

    Velzey Estacada, Oregon Gunsmith Gunsmith Bronze Vendor Bronze Supporter

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    I don't remember seeing locks on many of my classroom doors. But if you had a minute of two you could put up quite the barricade in front of the door.
    If they opened the door and made themselves visible they would be dead. Of course you have to make sure, that's the shooter :(
    So many variables.
    I have never been one to get buck fever, etc etc. But I bet I would wish I had my trusty FAL! Some of these guys these days are wearing vests. Your center mass shoots with your 9mm pew pew isn't going to cut it. Neck, and head shots just like deer and elk, takes them down all the time!
     
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  10. SWWSurplus

    SWWSurplus New Member

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    We're going to cover some aspects of Active Shooter in January that are useful to understand, but this format is too short for much in the way of practicing tactics.
     
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  11. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    CoastRange57 likes this.
  12. edison bulb

    edison bulb Portland, OR Well-Known Member

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    I like the ESCAPE, HIDE, FIGHT system for a mass shooting when the shooting starts outside. Setting up an ambush would be great. I imagine it would be highly effective, especially if two people with concealed handguns were present...the mass shooter would NOT be expecting this whatsoever.
     
  13. edison bulb

    edison bulb Portland, OR Well-Known Member

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    is that photo really him? I sure hope so! F*** that piece of S.
     
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  14. CoastRange57

    CoastRange57 Western Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    The same concept works great when buying ham radios / other gear on eBay. Wait until about 20 seconds before an auction closes, the drop a bid at least 2 bid steps above yours ( if you want to pay that) and you will get it every time. Good fast connection helps out.

    Not that I would ever do that. I have heard of guys doing that. :rolleyes:
     
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  15. CoastRange57

    CoastRange57 Western Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I had to get between an armed criminal and about 8 other people, only one of whom had training and was of assistance. (my wife). The others would not obey my commands until I got downright brutal with them, and certainly did nothing to help the situation out. Fortunately I had tactical advantage, but the sheep wanted to watch me instead of going to cover as instructed. When you have to explain the why of something, you lose precious seconds.

    Expecting a small group of disseparate people to come together and execute some type of offensive action or even good defensive action is not going to happen. You are probably going it alone if you want to to be marginally effective.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2015
  16. Karen Payne

    Karen Payne Salem 1911 girl Bronze Supporter

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    I have taken classes back East where the instructor with a lot of experience takes you through various situations with and without weapons and when weapons are employed it's Simmunitions so you know without a doubt if you or the target was hit. The instructor does not allow simply anyone to take this course, one must be vetted first.

    One thing is clear and should be to everyone is when SHTF all bets are off, weapons are not always the solution and heaven forbid you are seen as the shooter. A good read is Terror at Beslan which is a very good and if by chance you can catch the documentary online that is a plus.
     
  17. edison bulb

    edison bulb Portland, OR Well-Known Member

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    Good points, Karen. Sounds like a very useful course!

    I'm not aware of this ever happening. Police are trained to (somewhat) expect civilians with firearms. In addition, an armed civilian would be seen running or hiding with the crowd...whereas the violent mass shooter would be shooting at the crowd.

    Either way, if you have to shoot and if you are successful at stopping the threat(s)...I personally would holster my pistol and keep hands up high before the police arrive! Definitely don't want to be seen holding a pistol.


    --------------------------------------------------
    Proud member and supporter of

    Oregon Firearms Federation
    Gun Owners of America
    Second Amendment Foundation
    National Rifle Association
     
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  18. Karen Payne

    Karen Payne Salem 1911 girl Bronze Supporter

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    The key here is if not trained properly, don't holster your firearm then this can be a problem. In regards to this not happening, that does not mean it can't happen as no doubt we have not yet been fully tested.
     
  19. irongoat66

    irongoat66 Idaho Member

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    As far as aftermath a little preplanning goes a long ways, check into ccw insurance and keep your mouth shut, police will try to get you to talk before reading your rights your rights, inocent until PROVEN guilty, make them work, oh and put the bad guy down for a dirt nap. (No lawsuits)
     
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  20. PaulB47

    PaulB47 Hillsboro Well-Known Member

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