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Hello,
Is it still legal to purchase or sell 80% unfinished frame kits in Washington? I notice the on-line retailers are all out of stock or no longer sell them. One site sells them but wants scanned DL and CPL info emailed to them. And I understand something soon will be done on the Federal level to regulate or ban 80% frames. It looks like 80% unfinished frames (P80 etc) are still legal in Washinton through June 30th as per HB1705, so I could theoretically buy or sell a P80 frame legally if I found one? Just wanna confirm this and is the case thanks!
 
Sorry I think I answered one of my own questions.. looks like the Fed's final rule requires all receivers / frame have a S/N by August 24th. Ok to possess unregistered 80% for own use after that date. So the WA state deadline of July 1st hits us first. Now - Are folks still able to sell new / un-used 80% frame kits on NWF until the June 30 deadline??
 
I'm no lawyer, but as far as I understand it, 80% frame kits are still legal to purchase and sell in WA. By that I mean unmodified frame kits. As far as building out an 80% frame kit into a functional firearm then it is only legal to possess if it is intended for personal use.

So... yes. It should be perfectly fine to sell or purchase a non modified 80% frame kit, Ie., NWFA classifieds, until the effective date of any state or federal rule change currently on the books.

I know there has been a lot of confusion around WA's new HB's and rule changes. Some online outlets may be a little unclear and erroring on the side of caution to be requiring DL''s and/or CHL documentation for purchase(?)
 
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Online availability... that's likely due to higher demand for those that want to get in before the federal rule takes affect. It might also be that MFG's have slowed production in anticipation of the rule impact.

I DID just see some in stock somewhere or other a day or 2 ago. I don't recall exactly where, but noticed, "wow! Price hike much!??"... and thinking they were probably trying to take advantage and cash in before the new rule takes affect(?)
 
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Thanks Yarome I appreciate your input!! And if anyone is selling they'd want to get rid of them before the regulations come down. Think I've got a couple kits I never dove into learning to make, will find and maybe list on here if there's interest. Surprised I didn't see anyone selling them recently, with all the hoopla..
 
Surprised I didn't see anyone selling them recently, with all the hoopla..
Well... pre-rule purchased would be something most people would want to hold onto since they can not be easily, nor as cheaply, and if at all... aquired once the rule goes into effect.

There is nothing prohibiting possession or personal use of them. You just can't buy or sell any that are non serialized after the deadline.

On Edit: For most anyway. Some states are moving to limit or prohibit even possession without serialization.
 
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Did you check to see what Washington HB1705 says?

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Did you check to see what Washington HB1705 says?

View attachment 1213265
Yes I did but didn't see this "NEW" section. This goes against everything else I've read so far!! Everything else I've seen showed it was legal to possess a completed untraceable firearm for your own use. Maybe that's just the Fed's stance, and WA state is making simple possession a crime now. This is so unbelievably confusing now, with separate State And Federal laws on these.
 
This goes against everything else I've read so far!! Everything else I've seen showed it was legal to possess a completed untraceable firearm for your own use. Maybe that's just the Fed's stance, and WA state is making simple possession a crime now. This is so unbelievably confusing now, with separate State And Federal laws on these.
One of my replies might have been confusing, but was referring only to "currently active" laws or the federal rule.

As of right now, you're correct (as far as I know). You can buy and sell an incomplete frame and you may build one if intended for personal use. Would you want to with the looming new law deadlines? That's for each to decide, but as of right now, and talking about buying or selling an 80% frame, specifically, you still have a little time. Both getting under the wire for WA's new law as well as mfg still able to sell an unserialized... until the federal rule takes affect.

What 1705 seems to do is make it illegal to possess an untraceable firearm manufactured/assembled AFTER July 1st, 2019... or... unfinished frame that is not serialized, but you have until March 10, 2023 to either get rid of it, destroy it, or have it serialized.

Interesting to watch:
 
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So are there even FFLs that are properly set up to serialize ghost guns anywhere in Washington?
WA? I dunno, but I'm sure they will be more offering that service as the 2023 deadline approaches. I know there are online services (mail in), now, that will do it, but being in Oregon, it's not something I've looked into much. Kinda has to be some kinda plan to implement widespread services though since WA is going the gestapo mandatory compliance route.
 
I know there are online services (mail in), now, that will do it
mail in a finished ghost gun frame? That doesn't sound right.

To clarify my question Im wondering about all the ghost guns that are finished builds the owner needs to get serialized. They have less than a year.
 
mail in a finished ghost gun frame? That doesn't sound right.
You might be right. I haven't looked at the details really, just noticed some sites recently started offering serial engraving. There may be some limitations... like one I pulled up:

"You cannot send us an 80% lower if it has been machined or modified in any way. 100% ( from the manufacturer) Lower Receivers can be mailed-in but MUST be shipped from a certified FFL holder."

So non milled or 100%'s only. Dunno about others service providers.

There may not be many or any in WA at the moment (honestly don't know), but no doubt something is in the works for FFL's, that want to, will be able to provide the service. Like they did in Kalifederation. Not likely to be all that cheap, I would imagine.

TBH though, I would be shocked if there aren't already some WA FFL's fully capable and already doing it.
 
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You might be right. I haven't looked at the details really, just noticed some sites recently started offering serial engraving. There may be some limitations... like one I pulled up:

"You cannot send us an 80% lower if it has been machined or modified in any way. 100% ( from the manufacturer) Lower Receivers can be mailed-in but MUST be shipped from a certified FFL holder."

So non milled or 100%'s only. Dunno about others service providers.

There may not be many or any in WA at the moment (honestly don't know), but no doubt something is in the works for FFL's, that want to, will be able to provide the service. Like they did in Kalifederation. Not likely to be all that cheap, I would imagine.

TBH though, I would be shocked if there aren't already some WA FFL's fully capable and already doing it.
Maybe they mean you can mail in your untouched 80% -or- send your modified "80%" in thru an FFL. Just my guess.

The problem with this is it makes little sense for a gun shop to invest in setting up to serialize when in less than a year it will become legally pointless for anyone to build an 80%.
 
The problem with this is it makes little sense for a gun shop to invest in setting up to serialize when in less than a year it will become legally pointless for anyone to build an 80%.
That all depends on what hoops will be required, setup costs and what they can get away with charging for the service. I bet it won't be cheap and even a years worth serializing thousands of lowers might still induce many to tap into a new short term revenue stream. Beyond that, there may still be a limited demand for it. People moving in State or new iterations of "home build" products we are yet to see.

What they can get away with charging might be key. At some point, it might make more sense to simply destroy what you have and purchase a new 100% stripped lower serialized by the mfg than pay to serialize an 80% build.

There will always be a certain number of people doing home builds simply for the enjoyment and creativity factors of it. Costs be damned...

It's all academic until the wheels are in motion.
 

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