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Well I'd continue to call yourself non-omnipotent.
And just for your information, the .223/556 can be fired from other than an AR.
It is a useless caliber in the Alaskan bush. I don't know anyone that would bother carrying one. Too small for personal protection or use on Alaskan game.........what would it be good for? I have seen Garand's, various 308's and shotguns all of which are useful.
 
It is a useless caliber in the Alaskan bush. I don't know anyone that would bother carrying one. Too small for personal protection or use on Alaskan game.........what would it be good for? I have seen Garand's, various 308's and shotguns all of which are useful.
Tell that to native (not fat white sunt "native") Alaskans/wtf?
 
You are so articulate...........tough time making a sentence.
"The real Alaskan hunters......the native Americans, use more 30-06 than anything.."

Pray tell us more. Or just stop and not, O real Alaskan hunter. lulz

upload_2017-12-9_15-26-15.jpeg
 
Don't make me stop this thread and go back there kids! :D

This thread is about the .458 x2 American cartridge...
Its usefulness...
Load data...
Who has used it...
What game is it useful for...
Things like that...
Lets all remember rule number 1 please : Be excellent to each other...
Thank you.
Andy
 
Jeez Louise! Why on earth would we need to argue about the utilitarian aspects of this cartridge?

If the .458 Winchester isn't enough, there's always the .458 Lott. (The .458 Lott will chamber and shoot both cartridges).
 
Okay. Let's herd these cats. Two .458 American stories. The first is first-hand (I was there), and falls in the category of "Mean things we do to our little brothers":

Aforementioned best friend, my younger brother, and myself were "testing out" the newly-built American on the 700 action, with the Leupold 1.5-5x on it. Friend ran it through its paces (after targeting), doing rapid fire drills as if using it for a stopping rifle. Little brother and I looked on, and laughed out loud as to what this relatively small gun with a not relatively small cartridge did to hair on the human head during recoil.

Then it was my turn: I placed one foot well forward, leaned into the gun and fired one shot. The two onlookers assumed their rightful place as the audience in a slapstick comedy, dutifully guffawing at the appropriate moment. With no lasting damage to my physical countenance, I went ahead and finished out the magazine much as the owner had.

Little brother's turn: (he was a legal adult, so no child abuse occurred here). He had never shot a "big gun", unless you consider a 50-70 Sharps carbine in that category. As the older brother, I felt obligated to offer sage advice (as I had throughout our childhood together, with sometimes mixed results). I counseled him to "lean into it", as I had. What I forgot to counsel him about was in regard to his trait (shared by our father) to throw his head forward on the comb on ANY rifle. (I found constant frustration with their scopes always mounted too far forward for my tastes and technique.)

At the shot, brother's head moved in a measurably more rapid fashion that that of my friend or myself. Noticeable in the atmosphere around the head was an ethereal mist that made any image past it seem as if one was wearing rose-colored glasses. Little brother almost dropped the gun, but gathered and held on, and when he turned to face us, we quit laughing pretty quick. For the rest of his life, he sported a "frown mark" just west of his nose that perfectly matched the curvature of a Leupold 1.5-5x ocular.

His indoctrination into the Weatherby Eyebrow Society. (No help from Roy on this one.)

(to be continued).
 
The .458 American in the field: This is 2nd hand information to me from the gun owner (I was not there).

Aforementioned friend and 3 neighbors in Eastern Oregon drew cow tags for a damage control hunt shortly after he'd built the gun (and after Little Brother's instantaneous cosmetic surgery described above).

As happens often in such hunts, the offending elk herd was difficult to locate once the hunt had opened, and then once the herd was located, things happened quite fast. On the fourth day of a discouraging hunt, the four hunters were scouring a ridge above a clearing, and the .458 American owner had moved down some to rest a bit and sat watching the clearing (figuring whatever "depredations" were being committed on crops in the area had been done by suspects who'd fled the region).

Then all quickly changed. In a single file column, pushed off the ridge by the other hunters, the herd burst into the clearing at a trot, at 150 yards. Inside of one minute 4 shots put 4 cows on the ground.

Sanctimonious pontification toward this story might be expected. Directed at me, it would be misplaced. Again: I was not there, but I do know that 4 allotted tags for this damage control operation were filled toward the goal, and four families in Eastern Oregon did not have to buy beef for their kids that winter. I also know that when one looks into the face of hungry kids, sometimes formalities and legalities take second fiddle. I know my Dad did such for us.

I also know the .458 American was the right tool at the right time for the job. This was business.
 
I don't think anyone was saying it isn't an effective caliber, to me, it is unnessisary overlap between the 45/70 and 458. My light 458's are the same loading without special brass and still fit in a standard length bolt rifle.
 
The account I rendered was not in answer to anyone aside from the OP, and in effort to keep this thread on track. I agree that no one here challenged the caliber's effectiveness (most probably due to lack of experience with it). I offered two accounts of that (one first hand).

As to three attributes assigned to a .458 Win, I am in agreement that it can easily be loaded to American (or .45-70) velocities. As to "special brass", I would question that assignment where the American is concerned. It's really not "special" at all, requiring only chopping any belted magnum (in the .300/7mm/.264/.338, et al class) to 2" and go to town.

In fact, I would respectfully submit that the .458 American brass is LESS "special" than .458 Winchester brass when one considers the nearly limitless (and often cost-free) source of multiple calibers that serve well as parent brass. The last time I priced .458 Winchester brass, the tag on it was (in my evaluation) quite "special". It is also somewhat rare to find it just laying around at the range.

As to the .458 Win fitting in a standard length bolt rifle, once again I acknowledge that attribute. I would request acknowledgement in kind for the American's ability to fit in a short action (for what that is worth to some persons, including myself).

As to "caliber overlap", once again such a point of view may be not without foundation. However, I would wager that a trip to any gun safe of moderate holdings, comparing one rifle against another would reveal a number of guns that suffer this horrible detrimental characteristic.
 
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People who only have guns that they "need" worry me.

Of course there are better calibers. That is true of every cartridge (except the .30-06, none better than that).

But if I kept only to calibers that did a specific job with no overlap, I wouldn't be a "super" gun owner. And then what fun would life be?
 

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