38 Spc Reloading - Making +P ammo

[Fez]

Hi folks, when reloading 38 Spc with powders like Titegroup I've noticed the case is not very full.

Is it possible to +P 38 cases to .357 mag charges safely? I ask because 357 brass isn't easily accessible right now.

Thanks in advance.

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[homeuser6]

bad idea

 

[RVTECH]

bad idea

Ditto this!

If someone ever got a hold of you MAG charges in .38 Special brass and actually decided to shoot them (in a .38 Special only gun) , well enough said.

 

[Fez]

Thanks. Could you expand on why?

There's definitely the potential of using a super-charged 38-seeming round in a 38 Spc, which would be really bad. However, I don't have a 38 Spc, diligently mark every reload and don't give/sell them to others - my use only.

Are there any other differences between 38spc and 357 mag cases aside from the extra 1/8" length? Perhaps the necessary empty space in the cartridge is a factor?

I'm asking in the context of an extreme WROL sort of situation.

 

[RVTECH]

Thanks. Could you expand on why?

No to your question about the .38 and .357 cases however you can get excessive buildup in the cylinder shooting a lot of .38s in a .357 gun - regardless of the charge HOWEVER to 'expand on why' it's all about safety. Ammo can get lost, forgotten etc. no matter how diligent you are about marking them and ensuring you don't give it away or sell it.

Wouldn't you be a bit stressed if you lost or forgot some ammo while out shooting?

Are you having a seriously hard time finding .357 brass ? If so I can probably spare some. How much are you looking for?

 

[oremike]

38 Special brass is made to withstand about 16,000 psi where as 357's operating preessures can be as high as about 40,000. Not all brass is made equal. By putting the higher pressure load in the smaller cases you will be over pressuring even more. So BAD idea over all.

 

[Fez]

No to your question about the .38 and .357 cases however you can get excessive buildup in the cylinder shooting a lot of .38s in a .357 gun - regardless of the charge HOWEVER to 'expand on why' it's all about safety. Ammo can get lost, forgotten etc. no matter how diligent you are about marking them and ensuring you don't give it away or sell it.

Wouldn't you be a bit stressed if you lost or forgot some ammo while out shooting?

Are you having a seriously hard time finding .357 brass ? If so I can probably spare some. How much are you looking for?

Agreed, thanks. I'm not planning to do this, I was just wondering in the case of a dire straits WROL situation where I've got to use what's on hand.

Thanks for the note about the 38 buildup, I'm pretty fastidious about cleaning my firearms after use but I'll definitely pay closer attention to my 357 as I mostly shoot 38 through it.

I only have about 50 357 cases currently and would definitely like to have more on hand. How many would be worth your while to spare and what would you like for them? I've got a bunch of brass for calibers I don't use if you want to trade. Cheers!

 

[Fez]

38 Special brass is made to withstand about 16,000 psi where as 357's operating preessures can be as high as about 40,000. Not all brass is made equal. By putting the higher pressure load in the smaller cases you will be over pressuring even more. So BAD idea over all.

That definitely is an excellent reason! Cheers.

 

[RVTECH]

How many would be worth your while to spare

I'll see what I got and get back with you. They will be nickel plated and I'd just send 'em to ya !

 

[Camelfilter]

Agreed, thanks. I'm not planning to do this, I was just wondering in the case of a dire straits WROL situation where I've got to use what's on hand...

Well in that case, you use what's on hand & make .38. Normal .38.

That simple, really.

 

[2Wheels4Ever]

I do the unspeakable....

I consistently load .38 brass to .357 levels. In fact, I have some .38 brass that's been loaded hot over 15 times and still going strong.

Note:

Only I shoot my ammo.

I only own guns chambered in .357 (no .38 specials.)

I shoot my ammunition exclusively on my own property.

In the thousands of rounds I've loaded, only one case has separated upon extraction, and it was easily removed. (Could of happened at any charge level when using old brass.)

I'm not recommending you do it, but it can be done, and I'll continue to do it.

 

[Camelfilter]

I do the unspeakable....

I consistently load .38 brass to .357 levels. In fact, I have some .38 brass that's been loaded hot over 15 times and still going strong.

Note:

Only I shoot my ammo.

I only own guns chambered in .357 (no .38 specials.)

I shoot my ammunition exclusively on my own property.

In the thousands of rounds I've loaded, only one case has separated upon extraction, and it was easily removed. (Could of happened at any charge level when using old brass.)

I'm not recommending you do it, but it can be done, and I'll continue to do it.

Absolutely! You've spent the time working up the loads for you, which work for you, with tools available in normalcy.

My concern is the OP is asking about putting up loads simply from book or recipe, as tools in normalcy likely wouldn't be available. Higher, perhaps over pressure loads at that.

In the circumstance the OP is mentioning (Failed normalcy), it would be best that the OP load what he has in the passed, which he knows works. Rather than trying for max/beyond max, on something he hadnt done...

Now, if the OP wants to spend the time working up such. Now. For his guns, with what he has. Sure.

Just doesn't sound like a great idea. To me.

-Because the OP is asking.

 

[oremike]

I do the opposite, I load a 38+P load in a 357 case to make a nice pleasant and accurate target load. No need to make wrist busters to kill pop cans and paper.

 

[JRuby]

I do nor see a lot of difference between a model 15 and s model 19 S&W. I load 38P++ loads in my revolvers with HS6. What you want not to happen is to shoot those loads in a weaker action and there are some out there.

 

[Throckmorton]

have u put a wtb for .357 brass on the classifieds ? you'd be amazed how well a wtb works,I always get what I need .

 

[Mikej]

Hi folks, when reloading 38 Spc with powders like Titegroup I've noticed the case is not very full.

Is it possible to +P 38 cases to .357 mag charges safely? I ask because 357 brass isn't easily accessible right now.

Thanks in advance.

edited
The scary part here is using a powder like Titegroup for magnum handgun charges. Being Titegroup is a very fast powder compared to more traditional magnum handgun powders, such as H110, 2400, others I'm not familiar with but might guess from looking at a burn rate chart, your getting into dangerous pressure spike territory.

To your question, I'm sure it's possible to load .38 special cases to mag pressures. Titegroup isn't the powder to test it with though.


Disclaimer:
Moving away from established loading data may be dangerous.

 

[RVTECH]

The scary part here is using a powder like Titegroup for magnum handgun charges.

Not as long as the OP sticks with established data for the powder.

A lot of very fast powders have data that show loads in the 'magnum' category but they are not excessive.

NOW if he is EXCEEDING posted data then that of course would not be safe - regardless of the powder used.

 

[Mikej]

Not as long as the OP sticks with established data for the powder.

A lot of very fast powders have data that show loads in the 'magnum' category but they are not excessive.

NOW if he is EXCEEDING posted data then that of course would not be safe - regardless of the powder used.

Sure enough, there's data for Titegroup for .357mag. There's also data for Clays which is even faster than Titegroup. I've never been a magnum handgun fan so have dabbled very little in the category. I edited above.

 

[RVTECH]

I've never been a magnum handgun fan so have dabbled very little in the category.

Neither have I . The only time I have ever loaded 'full house' .357 was for my two .357 rifles (one now) but I have found a nice 'light' load that shoots well out of both my Henry and my Mod 66 Smith and that's all I need to kill pine cones with!

Thunderous recoil and report not needed!

 

[Mikej]

Thunderous recoil and report not needed!

Indeed.