270 Win is a better cartridge than 6.5 Creedmoor

Grizzly_A

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I have never had an elk show up and die in front of me @ 500yds because I had the right math formula. Choot'em in the head/neck and they bang-flop, and caliber doesn't matter as much. If you choot'em in the rump meat they will still run off regardless of caliber. Basically, it depends MOSTLY on the hunter's ability to be ethical and know their range and abilities.

(I do like Chuck's Formula, and your calculations)

Theoretically, we just need more hunting time with the 6.5CM and see if the performance on paper effectively takes game at ranges humanely compared with the 270win. The formulas say it should, but I've already heard of one thread where an elk was not retrieved after getting shot with a 6.5 with good shot placement.

I completely agree with @JRuby. Hunting is rarely perfect, so you might as well tip the odds in your favor where you can easily do so.
 

tac

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Don't remember source of information but the .270 was used to kill more elk than any other caliber.
In North America, probably.

In Scandinavia the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser cartridge has been sending elk and moose to the Great Pasture in the Sky since 1895. No Johnny-come-lately cartridge of the last 60-odd years is EVER going to beat that figure.

Our interpreter's dad started shooting elk back before WW2 and when he gave up, not only did he hand over his old open-sighted rifle, but his log, so that his boy knew what he had to do to keep up. With a compulsory five-year gap due to WW2 and nazi occupation, he managed to shoot an average of three a week, every week of his life, from 1926 up until 1988.
 

JRuby

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In North America, probably.

In Scandinavia the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser cartridge has been sending elk and moose to the Great Pasture in the Sky since 1895. No Johnny-come-lately cartridge of the last 60-odd years is EVER going to beat that figure.

Our interpreter's dad started shooting elk back before WW2 and when he gave up, not only did he hand over his old open-sighted rifle, but his log, so that his boy knew what he had to do to keep up. With a compulsory five-year gap due to WW2 and nazi occupation, he managed to shoot an average of three a week, every week of his life, from 1926 up until 1988.
Sounds like they have / had a lot more elg over thier and since it was open sighted rifle i wonder about how long those shots were. Need some more details.
 

JRuby

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Long enough to work, obviously. There are no thousand yard 'marksmen' shooting animals in Scandinavia.
I have great respect for the swede and would someday like to own another but i do believe it to be comparable to a 7×57. It is not a 300 yard plus elk rifle. IMHO
 

Spitpatch

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Mathematics and speculation aside. Field experience with the .270 side by side with the 6.5 ("Creedmoor equivalent") at the same moment might be helpful to some.

Brooks Range, Alaska. PC era (Chronologically "Pre-Creedmoor") 100 miles above the Arctic Circle.

I carried a .270. My partner carried a Swede Carbine in 6.5 (internally modified: glass bedded, custom trigger, etc.). A VERY accurate little gun and in this abbreviated configuration (16" barrel) the handloaded Swedish cartridge is handicapped to velocities corresponding exactly to a Creedmoor in a 22" barrel.

The shot: 375yards. 4 Rams. Two above the rest not only in location, but also in horn size.
My first shot was a hit. Partner shot low. With a muzzle brake allowing me to actually see bullet impact, my second shot was also a hit.
Partner's second and third shots were misses (again low).


Sheep Rifle (2).png

Does this "prove" the .270 is "better"? NO!
With background knowledge of preparation it only proves (to me at least) that I spent more time with my rifle prior to the hunt.
 
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In North America, probably.

In Scandinavia the 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser cartridge has been sending elk and moose to the Great Pasture in the Sky since 1895. No Johnny-come-lately cartridge of the last 60-odd years is EVER going to beat that figure.

Our interpreter's dad started shooting elk back before WW2 and when he gave up, not only did he hand over his old open-sighted rifle, but his log, so that his boy knew what he had to do to keep up. With a compulsory five-year gap due to WW2 and nazi occupation, he managed to shoot an average of three a week, every week of his life, from 1926 up until 1988.
The deer really enjoyed the wartime break. :s0090:
 

tac

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The deer really enjoyed the wartime break. :s0090:
Sadly, and the the eternal shame of many Norwegians, there were still sufficient 'quislings' available - Norwegian nationals authorised by the nazis to have firearms - to make serious inroads into the elk populations. Besides, many of them were also taken on their migratory routes into Northern Sweden - Norrmark.

Now, back to the never-ending argument of which is the better calibre - xyz or XYZ.......
 

osprey

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I love the 6.5 Creedmoor but have only shot 3 deer with it. I also have great revererance for my 270 and it has 3 elk and many deer to its credit. For deer and the ranges I am willing to shoot both are equally up to the task as far as I can tell. If we start talking bigger critters out past 250yds or so, it is advantage 270. The 270 is actually my back up elk and deer rifle. My 280 ai is my elk rifle. To me I have the perfect North American game battery with those 3. If I could only have one it would be the 280 ai.
 
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(insert particular cartridge here) killed more (insert particular game species here) than all the rest put together..... An old friend that I used to hunt with and who is responsible for my gun addiction used to finish that saying with " and probably wounded more as well..."
 

JRuby

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Spitpatch has been an ardent believer in the 250 so thier must be something I am missing about this cartridge.i once had a savage 99 in this cartridge and personally thought it indistinguishable from a good 243. I must be missing something.
 
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I have never had an elk show up and die in front of me @ 500yds because I had the right math formula. Choot'em in the head/neck and they bang-flop, and caliber doesn't matter as much. If you choot'em in the rump meat they will still run off regardless of caliber. Basically, it depends MOSTLY on the hunter's ability to be ethical and know their range and abilities.

(I do like Chuck's Formula, and your calculations)
I do agree with this 100% but when I pulled up my old bookmark it finally clicked how useful it was, I wound up comparing other calibers I hunt with and those values correlated nicely with my practical experiences with each caliber. I was up too late writing down ballistics... but it was fun.
At the end of the day, shot placement.
 

Spitpatch

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Ok, so you keep an old cartridge alive. Lets go find a new rifle in 250 Savage that isn’t a Remington Commemorative rifle that didn’t sell worth a damn.
Coulda said the same thing about the .45-70 about 30 years ago.:cool: Savage chambered the .250 in a 110 variant not too very long ago.

So, just so I understand: your criteria is if there is no new factory gun available, the cartridge is "dead". Don't think I wanna live in that world.
 

Spitpatch

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Spitpatch has been an ardent believer in the 250 so thier must be something I am missing about this cartridge.i once had a savage 99 in this cartridge and personally thought it indistinguishable from a good 243. I must be missing something.
For those with experience with the .243 and the .250, it is generally said (and my experience supports) that the .250 "punches above its weight". (Ballistic charts insist they're near equals). The 7x57 Mauser is another cartridge that is often attached to this phrase regarding its capability in the field that belies statistics.

So, no, you're not really missing anything except a cartridge that kills better (my opinion by experience with both),....and a pile of cash you'd get right now for that 99.:D
 
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I find it hilarious all the arguing over my many years which cartridge is better, the 6.8 mm or the 7mm. and now the 6.5 mm joins the fray. I started out with the 270, after a few years I got a good deal on a custom 7 mag and shot it many years. I started shooting the AR platform and built an AR-10 in 7mm-08. All three of these would shoot amazingly tight groups, and I don't think the animals I killed over the years could tell the difference in these. I welcome the 6.5 into this game. It is like watching a good football game between 2 teams that you don't care about, but it is still good football
 

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