270 wby mag accuracy problem

[leeradtke]

I have a mid 80s Japan 270 wby mag fibermark. It's never been accurate so I've hunted with it very little. I full floated the barrel which helped some. I realized it wasn't glass bedded, just a block behind the front receiver lug so I just finished bedding it. Haven't fired it yet. To point, I've loaded numerous different loades for it usually using nozler partition bullets. Does anyone have a favorite , accurate load for they're 270 wby you'd like to share? It would be appreciated. Thanks for your input, Lee.

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[Pepe-lepew]

What is your accuracy expectation? What is the rifle doing for accuracy?

 

[Burninpowder]

What is the barrel twist rate on the rifle and what grain bullets were you shooting out of it?

 

[Certaindeaf]

In the old days wby rifles had extremely long throats so that'd be the first thing I'd check.

 

[leeradtke]

In the old days wby rifles had extremely long throats so that'd be the first thing I'd check.

If so then you'd recommend seating the bullets out a little further?

 

[leeradtke]

What is the barrel twist rate on the rifle and what grain bullets were you shooting out of it?

Do not know the barrel twist or how to find out. I'm using 150 gr nozler partition

 

[leeradtke]

What is your accuracy expectation? What is the rifle doing for accuracy?

1" groups or less is my target. I'm not sure I've gotten it down to 2", probably more like 2 1/2"

 

[leeradtke]

1" groups or less is my target. I'm not sure I've gotten it down to 2", probably more like 2 1/2"

My sako 300 wsm gives me groups with three holes touching with factory factory federal premiums.

 

[po18guy]

If so then you'd recommend seating the bullets out a little further?

It is certainly worth experimenting weith. Seat the bullets shallow, maybe choose longer/heavier bullets, there are a number of things you can try. First, take your usual bullets and slide one into a fired case. Try a case in which the bullet can be inserted with a bit of effort, so that it will hold its place in the case without sliding in or out on its own. Then chamber it slowly (rifle held horizontally) and extract. If done correctly, the depth that the rifling seated the bullet to as you chambered it will indicate your max overall length. Best results are often slightly shorter than max, but that's for the range. Try this 3-4 times and you should have your answer.

 

[Koda]

I full floated the barrel which helped some. I realized it wasn't glass bedded, just a block behind the front receiver lug so I just finished bedding it. Haven't fired it yet.

IMO bedding it could possibly be the thing it needed. I would fire it first. If your handloading for it I would get a Hornady OAL gauge and OAL case that way you can properly play with bullet jump to the lands to find the best group.

 

[flashpan]

I'll try and help here. I've handloaded for 4 different Japanese Weatherby Mark 5's...I asume yours is a Mark 5 and not a Vanguard?
None of mine were 270's but I found that all of them were picky about handloads and I don't believe they are inherently that accuate anyway. Weatherby used to send a test target with each rifle and most of those I've seen hover around 1 MOA. But know that Weatherby fine turned those loads for good test target results.
Accuracy was not my 1st focus as we were hunting Elk and AK moose. We picked the bullets we wanted to use on those animals, then loaded up to near max velocity. That's why you shoot a big magnum right? Our loads all shot around 1" groups after all the tinkering. Its common to get the first 2 bullets inside an 1" then see the group open up even with the heavier 26" barrels. If you have the slimmer 24" barrel then you know how fast it heats up...80grns of powder will do that! Floating and bedding was a good first move.
As mentioned by others these rifles have seriously long throats so bullets selection and seating depth is critical. Most throats are so long you cant get a bullet close to the lands so you will have to find a bullet that likes to jump. Good news is there are so many good bullets to choose from than 20 years ago. I have found Hornady ELD-X jump well in my 300 and Berger Hybrid hunting bullets are not so senstive to seating either in the 7mm Weath.
Powder choice did not seem to make a big differnce in my rifles, used a lot of Hodgdon stick powders...and prefered the SC versions.
Hope this helps ... good luck and enjoy load development.

 

[leeradtke]

I'll try and help here. I've handloaded for 4 different Japanese Weatherby Mark 5's...I asume yours is a Mark 5 and not a Vanguard?
None of mine were 270's but I found that all of them were picky about handloads and I don't believe they are inherently that accuate anyway. Weatherby used to send a test target with each rifle and most of those I've seen hover around 1 MOA. But know that Weatherby fine turned those loads for good test target results.
Accuracy was not my 1st focus as we were hunting Elk and AK moose. We picked the bullets we wanted to use on those animals, then loaded up to near max velocity. That's why you shoot a big magnum right? Our loads all shot around 1" groups after all the tinkering. Its common to get the first 2 bullets inside an 1" then see the group open up even with the heavier 26" barrels. If you have the slimmer 24" barrel then you know how fast it heats up...80grns of powder will do that! Floating and bedding was a good first move.
As mentioned by others these rifles have seriously long throats so bullets selection and seating depth is critical. Most throats are so long you cant get a bullet close to the lands so you will have to find a bullet that likes to jump. Good news is there are so many good bullets to choose from than 20 years ago. I have found Hornady ELD-X jump well in my 300 and Berger Hybrid hunting bullets are not so senstive to seating either in the 7mm Weath.
Powder choice did not seem to make a big differnce in my rifles, used a lot of Hodgdon stick powders...and prefered the SC versions.
Hope this helps ... good luck and enjoy load development.

Thanks for your thoughts, they're very much in line with my experience. With our business I haven't had the time to mess with development with this rifle. The last time I seated bullets out close the the lands (on our 7mm mag) I loaded our best load just before elk season and discovered an hour before light opening morning that the cartridges were a little long to feed smoothly through the magazine. Lesson learned - many years ago now.

 

[Burninpowder]

Do not know the barrel twist or how to find out. I'm using 150 gr nozler partition

I recall the gunsmith I go to talking about there was a different between the German made mark v and the Japan made mark v and him talking about how he has had customers in the past having issues with there rifles grouping. I can't remember what one had what but remember him saying the twist rate was different in one of them and that people were trying to shoot to heavy of a bullet and to shoot a lighter bullet weight. Might be something to try after the other above posts.

 

[Certaindeaf]

It's a paradox, really.




Lol. A play on the long long long looooòoooooong freebore of the old Paradox guns. I think they had like 3" of rifling.

 

[po18guy]

Finding your twist rate: Get a 1/4" wood dowel. Wrap it with masking tape (just one or two wraps) at 1 foot intervals. Just so it will slip into the bore with some drag. You want it tight enough that it will rotate with the rifling when pushed through the bore. Using a sharpie, make a straight line down the length of the dowel - the finer the line, the better. Push the dowel from breech to muzzle, until it appears at the muzzle and goes an inch or so out the muzzle. Mark the exit point around the dowel with a sharpie right at the muzzle. Then push the dowel slowly until that straight line makes precisely one turn. Measure from your exit point mark on the dowel back to the muzzle and the inches you measure will give you your twist rate, i.e. 8 inches is a 1:8 twist, 12 inches is 1:2 twist and so on.

 

[DLS]

Place a tight fitting patch on a quality cleaning rod ... one that smoothly allows the rod to turn as you push the patch through the bore.

Make a mark on the rod so you can tell when it has rotated a full revolution.

Insert the patch into the bore. Measure from any point on the gun to the base of the rod handle. Push the.patch farther into the bore until the rod makes one full revolution. Measure from the same spot on the gun to the base of the handle.

The difference in inches is your twist rate.

 

[po18guy]

Place a tight fitting patch on a quality cleaning rod ... on that smoothly allows the rod to turn as you push the patch through the bore.

Make a mark on the rod.so you can tell when it has rotated a full revolution.

Insert the patch into the bore. Measure from any point on the.gun to.the base of the rod handle. Push the.patch farther into the bore until the rod.makes one full revolution. Measure from gbe sam spot on the.gun to the. Ase of the handle. Tbe difference in inches is your twist rate.

The cleaning rod is a great idea, since the handle rotates and won't fuzz up the measurements.

 

[Going Tits Up]

Accurate loads depends on your twist rate. Seems load work up is confusing you.
Many questions for you,
How does it shoot Weatherby factory 130 grain loads? Guaranteed 1 moa.
Do you know the twist rate? Older = 1-12". Newer 1-9" determines bullet weight and length.
Working up a load is simple, go to Noslers website , look for the most accurate powder tested for the bullet. Use that specific powder, primer, bullet. The load data has an * astrick next to it. For example, in the 130 loads Reloader 19 @ 71 grains shoots best. Sierra has most accurate load data too but it's for their bullets.
My advice, deer, elk, shoot the 130's use the Nosler Overall length forget about the chamber and length to lands. The 130's will shoot in any twist rate made for the .270 wby.

270 Weatherby Magnum Load Data

Nosler, The World's Finest Bullets, Ammunition, Rifles, & Brass. We manufacture Partition, AccuBond, E-Tip, Ballistic Tip, BT Lead Free, Custom Competition, Solid, and Handgun Bullets.

www.nosler.com

 

[Going Tits Up]

One last thing, the rifles scope mounts, locktite, notorious for recoil and loosening.
Scope quality? Power?

 

[joken]

Is the brass you are using from the same manufacturer and lot?