22LR ammo debate-discourse

[FatBoy85]

Sorry, was trying to get an idea of why you want to store ammo in the first place.

If it helps, I've shot 22 over the last 15-20 years. Some older stuff shot just as good as the new stuff.

I've often wondered if the priming compound settles inside 22 cases over long periods of time. I haven't noticed such things. I figure it would become noticeable via increased amount of duds. The older stuff has about the same quantity of duds as the newer stuff.

No worries. I store most for the fun for my family later. Also I'm worried about prices not going to be much cheaper in the future as .22 ammo margins are razor thin in terms of profit but memories last forever. I'd be one to probably stick with the ammo that I've recently bought and hope to not have problems with it 5 years down the line. Bearing that reloading this ammo is impractical, I couldn't find a better reason to keep up on purchasing it if it's at least a decent deal. 10 cents a round is getting to be the norm...12 cents is my limit.

It has to be a reputable company like CCI, Sellier and Bellot, or RWS to just name a few that might be a box or two at a time. CCI sells shorts, CB's and subsonic but they are probably the ones I'm looking at in terms of non-bulk ammos worth laying some coin on. Here's where the exceptions exist but never in huge quantities.

 

[FatBoy85]

I don't shoot my 22 much but I I had lots of malfunctions with Federal Automatch that day though it grouped very good. Rem Golden bullet grouped the worst that day (prior its held 1/2" groups) and ironically it was the Remington Thunderbolt that grouped the best that day at 25 and 50yds. This was all older ammo I purchased maybe in the last 10 years or so. Recently I purchased some new CCI all copper and some Norma all copper for rabbit and grouse hunting (which I hardly ever do... ) but haven't tried them yet. As far as new production 22 being better than old stored ammo I don't think I could notice a difference for what I use 22 for. Somedays I shoot better than others and clean the gun better than other days.... I don't think that old stored ammo is less accurate. The thing about storing ammo for prepping is if that day came where you need it, you need it to all be the same brand to hold that zero.

You mention the best way that a finicky ammo by reputation can still have a good day. Lots of environmental conditions can play a part plus the gun. Heck some don't clean theirs religiously because they got a ton of cases that are wax lubed ammo. I've got Russian Junior bricks I wanna try out that are like this but have no idea if they'll do well. They are probably from the 60s and likely some of the oldest .22 ammo I've got.

 

[Member 34319]

No worries. I store most for the fun for my family later. Also I'm worried about prices not going to be much cheaper in the future as .22 ammo margins are razor thin in terms of profit but memories last forever. I'd be one to probably stick with the ammo that I've recently bought and hope to not have problems with it 5 years down the line. Bearing that reloading this ammo is impractical, I couldn't find a better reason to keep up on purchasing it if it's at least a decent deal. 10 cents a round is getting to be the norm...12 cents is my limit.

It has to be a reputable company like CCI, Sellier and Bellot, or RWS to just name a few that might be a box or two at a time. CCI sells shorts, CB's and subsonic but they are probably the ones I'm looking at in terms of non-bulk ammos worth laying some coin on. Here's where the exceptions exist but never in huge quantities.

If it's still cheaper to shoot 22 at 25 cents a round. I'd still be shooting it over 9mm or bigger. Especially if 9mm and bigger goes and or stays at 50-75 cents a round.

I do hope it goes back down to the 5-6 cent a round range though.

 

[FatBoy85]

If it's still cheaper to shoot 22 at 25 cents a round. I'd still be shooting it over 9mm or bigger. Especially if 9mm and bigger goes and or stays at 50-75 cents a round.

I do hope it goes back down to the 5-6 cent a round range though.

Same. Those other calibers seem much more volatile and it's a lot easier to reload them than buy at that price point... right now the .22 lowest is about 7.5 cents... it's still worth getting when you can find it. Limits or no.

 

[Member 34319]

Same. Those other calibers seem much more volatile and it's a lot easier to reload them than buy at that price point... right now the .22 lowest is about 7.5 cents... it's still worth getting when you can find it. Limits or no.

I haven't seen any in a bit that low.

I've been buying CCI off their website regularly. It's10 cents or more ish round, but it is available and good shooting.

I'm slowly dipping my feet into the precision rimfire stuff and looking at ammos that will cost about 20-30 a round. I won't be shooting a ton hopefully.

 

[FatBoy85]

I haven't seen any in a bit that low.

I've been buying CCI off their website regularly. It's10 cents or more ish round, but it is available and good shooting.

I'm slowly dipping my feet into the precision rimfire stuff and looking at ammos that will cost about 20-30 a round. I won't be shooting a ton hopefully.

Automatch from Wallys is about 21.16 and then the tax puts it close. At least with 3 box limits, I'm getting nearly 1000 rounds if I get them at every few weeks. Weather and time are against me in going to the range but I look forward to having my own property and use it for plinking. Saving for that other other "rainy day".

I hear the CZ rifles are best for that. Buying Lapua boxes at 20 plus a box isn't out of the ordinary but then some of the guys who shoot the lot their gun likes end up dropping a veritable nest egg on cases because of some competition? I hope they pay money to entrants or that's a hobby for the well-financed.

 

[The Heretic]

There are two sides to rimfire ammo malfunctions, and somewhat, accuracy problems; the ammo and the gun.

As noted, some guns like certain ammo that other guns hate. It might be the gun, it might be the ammo, it might be the combination - when it comes to malfunctions. When it comes to accuracy (more correctly, precision, i.e., small groups), if the ammo shoots small groups in one gun and large groups in another, it might not be the ammo but rather the gun. If the ammo won't shoot precisely in any gun, and other ammo does, then it is probably the ammo. If the ammo malfunctions in every type, make, model, instance of a gun, then it is probably the ammo.

I had an AWC G2A (M1A bullpup) that shot groups of less than 0.5 MOA (and I am not that good of a shot), but only with Federal GM 168gr HPBT ammo. It had a tensioned barrel tuned specifically for that ammo by the maker of the rifle. I tried 4 other brands of major brand US made "match" of the same projectile weight and type (IIRC) and none of them shot near that kind of precision - ranging from 1-1.5 MOA.

 

[The Heretic]

I haven't seen any in a bit that low.

I've been buying CCI off their website regularly. It's10 cents or more ish round, but it is available and good shooting.

I'm slowly dipping my feet into the precision rimfire stuff and looking at ammos that will cost about 20-30 a round. I won't be shooting a ton hopefully.

16 CPR :

WX2-296689 50 RD ELEY 22LR 38GR HP SUBSONIC​	$7.59​	11/23/20​	In-Stock​	10​
​

8CPR & 6 CPR
4/2020

Federal Premium 22 Long Rifle 40 Grain Match Tip Hollow Point 500 Rounds SKU: 720BR	2	$79.98
Federal Game Shok 22 LR 31 Grain Copper-Plated Hollow Point 500 Rounds SKU: 724BR	2	$59.98

Last I looked I couldn't find either of these match grade ammos for any price. Glad I got them when I did.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

I have shot new ammo and "old" ammo...any haven't really noticed any difference.
"Old" is in quotes....'cause its cartridge ammo and compared to what I usually shoot , anything with a cartridge is new...

Old in this case is .22LR and .22Short from the 1960's -1980s.
New would be .22LR from the 80's onwards....as some recently purchased ammo within a year ago.
Ammo brands have been :
CCI
Remington
Winchester
Federal
Eley
Aquila
Some steel cased Russian brand...Light blue box...
Any of the above have also been a mix of type as in :
Standard velocity , high velocity or "Stinger" , "Yellow Jacket" or other "Hyper-velocity" type.
As well as solid , plated ( copper or polymer washed) or hollow point.

Rifle used were either bolt ( singe shot or magazine fed ) and pump...all of various vintages.
Andy

 

[FatBoy85]

There are two sides to rimfire ammo malfunctions, and somewhat, accuracy problems; the ammo and the gun.

As noted, some guns like certain ammo that other guns hate. It might be the gun, it might be the ammo, it might be the combination - when it comes to malfunctions. When it comes to accuracy (more correctly, precision, i.e., small groups), if the ammo shoots small groups in one gun and large groups in another, it might not be the ammo but rather the gun. If the ammo won't shoot precisely in any gun, and other ammo does, then it is probably the ammo. If the ammo malfunctions in every type, make, model, instance of a gun, then it is probably the ammo.

I had an AWC G2A (M1A bullpup) that shot groups of less than 0.5 MOA (and I am not that good of a shot), but only with Federal GM 168gr HPBT ammo. It had a tensioned barrel tuned specifically for that ammo by the maker of the rifle. I tried 4 other brands of major brand US made "match" of the same projectile weight and type (IIRC) and none of them shot near that kind of precision - ranging from 1-1.5 MOA.

Barrel Harmonics and all that play a part, I'm sure. I'm not even gonna begin to get my toenails wet until I fire a handful of .22 guns more than what I've got and then precision stuff can come into play. I just don't know if firing precision ammo in a not so precision gun would make a good gun better but then it also sheds light on "shooting the bubblegum" doesn't it?

 

[FatBoy85]

I have shot new ammo and "old" ammo...any haven't really noticed any difference.
"Old" is in quotes....'cause its cartridge ammo and compared to what I usually shoot , anything with a cartridge is new...

Old in this case is .22LR and .22Short from the 1960's -1980s.
New would be .22LR from the 80's onwards....as some recently purchased ammo within a year ago.
Ammo brands have been :
CCI
Remington
Winchester
Federal
Eley
Aquila
Some steel cased Russian brand...Light blue box...
Any of the above have also been a mix of type as in :
Standard velocity , high velocity or "Stinger" , "Yellow Jacket" or other "Hyper-velocity" type.
As well as solid , plated ( copper or polymer washed) or hollow point.

Rifle used were either bolt ( singe shot or magazine fed ) and pump...all of various vintages.
Andy

Perfect. I'm loving this one because of the consideration of "old" is a classification of its own. Of course with proper storage, any of this stuff can last and then may be part of a by-gone era if you knew of an ammo that was a "sweet spot" or simply what was affordable and worked. I bought air gun pellets for this same reason. Variety helps a nuanced balance of outcomes and for different purposes. Targets or squirrels...it'll have a spot on a shelf.

 

[The Heretic]

Barrel Harmonics and all that play a part, I'm sure. I'm not even gonna begin to get my toenails wet until I fire a handful of .22 guns more than what I've got and then precision stuff can come into play. I just don't know if firing precision ammo in a not so precision gun would make a good gun better but then it also sheds light on "shooting the bubblegum" doesn't it?

If it the ammo shows better precision than other ammo and does so in multiple guns, then it is probably the ammo.

I have seen enough accuracy tests on YT and in my own guns, to feel that precision "match" ammo is significantly more precise than "bulk" ammo (for me, the group sizes were half that of bulk ammo). For hunting, say squirrels or rabbits, the precision HP ammo that expands on impact, is what I want for SHTF and maybe if I take up hunting again - a little.

I have about 1400 rounds of the precision ammo now so I am comfortable with that, but I think a couple thousand more would be good. I also need to compare it to "premium" ammo like CCI minimags/et. al.

 

[Member 34319]

50 yard 10 shot groups. CZ 457.

 

[CRBMoA]

My Dad recently gave me the remnants of a brick of Remington Yellow Jackets that we most likely started in the 1980's.

I ran a box of it and it was flawless.

 

[FatBoy85]

My Dad recently gave me the remnants of a brick of Remington Yellow Jackets that we most likely started in the 1980's.

I ran a box of it and it was flawless.

I'm trying to find those in stores. Online it's spendy for only 100 rounds though. Just found Remington Subsonics and a lot of subsonic rounds get a better reputation for holding more steady groups. I'm also waiting on cyclones. If I took out my whole stash of 22 I'd have to get a pretty good picture of things close up as well.

 

[orygun]

I shoot an old Marlin 81DL from the late 40's. I don't shoot long range with it, maybe popping the gong at 100 yards. Normally I shoot at ranges of 50 yards or less. It really doesn't matter what I'm shooting thru it, it shoots a lot like @Reno 's CZ. Even my old Ruger Standard shoots nearly everything well. I grew up spoiled with 22s that aren't picky. I did have a "brick" bulk pack Federals that seemed to have more misfires than most anything else.

 

[The Heretic]

I shoot an old Marlin 81DL from the late 40's. I don't shoot long range with it, maybe popping the gong at 100 yards. Normally I shoot at ranges of 50 yards or less. It really doesn't matter what I'm shooting thru it, it shoots a lot like @Reno 's CZ. Even my old Ruger Standard shoots nearly everything well. I grew up spoiled with 22s that aren't picky. I did have a "brick" bulk pack Federals that seemed to have more misfires than most anything else.

I grew up with a Marlin bolt action of that era, but with a box mag instead of tube, and the box mag was in pieces so I learned to make my shots with it count.

 

[Hueco]

50 yard 10 shot groups. CZ 457.

View attachment 1113701 View attachment 1113703 View attachment 1113704 View attachment 1113705 View attachment 1113706 View attachment 1113707 View attachment 1113708

Mine seems to really like Wolf Match…which is apparently made on old Eley machinery. 5 shot 50 yards:

 

[Member 34319]

Mine seems to really like Wolf Match…which is apparently made on old Eley machinery. 5 shot 50 yards:
View attachment 1113988

SGAmmo has wolf match right now. $100 per 500. I'm thinking of picking up a brick.

 

[Heyjoe]

I like CCI standard and Blazer brass best. Federal and Aguila have also performed well.

The one I won't buy under any circumstances is Winchester.