1875 Outlaw 45 as woods gun?

Muddy45LC · May 12, 2020

Hi all!

I am new here, but I had a question so I signed up.

I got a revolver off of Buds Gun Shop, and I was wondering if it would be adequate as a woods gun. I'm in Oregon, and the main concern would be cougars, and the black bears don't get real big here, so with that said, its an 1875 outlaw in 45 colt, imported by Cimarron. I have looked at many threads where people talked about 45LC as a viable caliber for protection in the woods, but usually the general opinion seems to be, "if you have a Ruger, and you make really hot hand loads, 45 is a good caliber."

What I want to know, is if this particular 45 would be adequate. I can make hand loads, but I know this thing can't withstand the same kind of pressures that a Ruger can.

So if anybody can give me there opinions, that would be great. Load suggestions are greatly appreciated as well.

Thanks, Johnny.

Roundball58 · May 12, 2020

A 250 gr slug at 850+ FPS is a standard factory load. It is more than adequate for anything you're likely to run into around here.

CLT65 · May 12, 2020

I have an old Uberti 1875 Remington, 45 Colt, and a Cimarron (Pietta) Pistolerro, also 45 Colt. I wouldn't feel undergunned out in the woods around here with either one of them. Compared to a .45 acp, the "Long Colt" has a heavier bullet going about the same speed. That's a lot of punch for most anything around here. If you figure on running into a moose or grizzly, then maybe something else...

For reloads, I wouldn't hot-rod an Italian reproduction revolver. I stick to conservative old-school Unique loads in mine, pretty much right at 850 fps with a 250gr bullet. I've heard that they are tougher than the original Colts and would probably take a little more, but I don't have any interest in pushing it. They are made of modern steel, but they are still not a Ruger.

doobee8 · May 12, 2020

Blazer 45LC with 200gr gold dot hollow points @ 1000fps.

Muddy45LC · May 12, 2020

Cool beans!

I have no interest in making up the "MANLIEST LOADS", I just want something that I can rely on if need be.

Thanks guys!

Bill Siegle · May 12, 2020

45Colt will do the job for sure! The Outlaw is a great looking gun too!

Ura-Ki · May 12, 2020

Over the years .45 Colt has gotten kind of a bad reputation as basically an over blown .45 ACP, a lot of that comes from people buying cheap ammo, or running cowboy action loads, which are at best spit wad power levels, running full pop .45 Colt is quite a bit more powerful, but for all things practical, your going to have to really work at it to get it to .44 magnum levels, but it's still a very powerful round, quite capable of doing basically the same things as the .44 mag, with the advantages of a better range of bullets to play with, Plus, it can throw a heavier bullet then the .44's so there are real advantages should you choose to experiment with them!

If you really wanna push the .45 Colt, you NEED a Ruger Super Black Hawk, with at least an 8 inch barrel and then you can really stretch that old Colt's legs! I have seen .45 Colt loads far exceed .44 magnum power levels, especially from rifles, but that's another thing entirely! I would stick to a 250 to 300 grain hard cast bullet, and carefully work up loads until you find the sweet spot between velocity and accuracy, and if you can get it to 900+FPS with out pressure issues, I would say your right where you need to be!

wewaits · May 13, 2020

That venerable old cartridge worked for years in both rifles and revolvers of dubious steel qualities and killed more wildlife than any caliber since the 50s, it'll work fine now there are very few big cats and bears here compared to a century ago.

XoXSciFiGuy · May 13, 2020

What about one of those S/W Ladysmiths in 357? Light, compact, pretty good punch although I think the cylinder only takes five cartridges. I always thought that would be a good one for packing in the woods.

CLT65 · May 13, 2020

Ura-Ki said:
Over the years .45 Colt has gotten kind of a bad reputation as basically an over blown .45 ACP, a lot of that comes from people buying cheap ammo, or running cowboy action loads, which are at best spit wad power levels, running full pop .45 Colt is quite a bit more powerful, but for all things practical, your going to have to really work at it to get it to .44 magnum levels, but it's still a very powerful round, quite capable of doing basically the same things as the .44 mag, with the advantages of a better range of bullets to play with, Plus, it can throw a heavier bullet then the .44's so there are real advantages should you choose to experiment with them!

If you really wanna push the .45 Colt, you NEED a Ruger Super Black Hawk, with at least an 8 inch barrel and then you can really stretch that old Colt's legs! I have seen .45 Colt loads far exceed .44 magnum power levels, especially from rifles, but that's another thing entirely! I would stick to a 250 to 300 grain hard cast bullet, and carefully work up loads until you find the sweet spot between velocity and accuracy, and if you can get it to 900+FPS with out pressure issues, I would say your right where you need to be!

I wonder if some of the ammo companies are worried about people blowing up vintage iron framed guns or something. I had a mostly-full box of Federal factory ammo I bought cheap at a show just for the brass. They were 225gr lead HP bullets. For curiosity I put a couple across the chronograph. As I recall they clocked about 750 fps. I guess that's fine for cowboy action loads, but ballistically it falls well below the old .45acp GI load. Definitely nothing to brag about.

Looking at reloading data, I think you can safely work up a .45 Colt load for an Italian revolver with a 250gr bullet at 900fps, without really pushing it for safety. The GI specs for 45acp are a 230gr bullet @830fps, for a ME of 350 foot-pounds. A 45 Colt load with a 250gr bullet @900fps develops 450 foot-pounds. That's a noticeable difference, and nothing to sneeze at.

In a Ruger revolver, 45 Colt is a whole different cartridge. It may have the same name and dimensions, but it's a different animal. If you want to stick with an Italian reproduction revolver, it's best to not even look at Ruger-only .45 Colt data.

oremike · May 13, 2020

The 45 Colt performance was what they wanted to get from the 45acp when they developed it:.45 ACP - Wikipedia
And as a woods carry caliber it will work well.

orygun · May 13, 2020

A cougar well hit with a 255gr LFP bullet out of a 45 Colt is dead.

41mag · May 13, 2020

There warn't no dang Rooogers roaming the woods hereabouts back in the Era of the Holy Black. Even the cap & ball era of Black Powder pistols served well.....avoiding Grizzlies of course. Modern standard commercial 45 Colt loads out of a modern revolver is quite adequate for what you describe. IMHO.

Kid@Heart · May 13, 2020

Let me see...

A single action 45LC to carry in the woods in case you run into "Gentle Ben"?
Brother, you better have nerves of steel and be proficient in the use of that cannon. You are only going to get one shot.
If you are dead set on a revolver, I would suggest trying out a double action. Not as many steps for your system to complete once you have gone into full "Oh Crap" mode. I used to carry a S&W model 29 when I was in the woods (Been a while, I don't camp much anymore). Nowadays, it's a Glock G40 in 10mm. Never know when you might run into Gentle Ben's cousin- Tweaker Bob.

Just my opinion.

aflineman · May 13, 2020

Kinda a tangent, but still sorta on topic.
I have a Blackhawk with a 45ACP and 45LC cylinder. When I shoot 45LC cowboy action loads in it, they are noticeably weaker than the 45 ACP brass Blazer loads in felt recoil. I have not shot them over a crono yet to compare.
Will all that said, I would look for a 45LC load which is not listed as Cowboy Action. Something a bit stouter will work well, without going into the realm of Ruger Blackhawk/Redhawk only loads. If all you can find is Cowboy Action loads, look for the heaviest you can find and shoot accurately. After you settle on that load, practice, practice, practice. You will probably never need to shoot a charging bear, but practicing for it can be the funnest part of owning that Outlaw 45.

oremike · May 13, 2020

Kid@Heart said:
Let me see...

A single action 45LC to carry in the woods in case you run into "Gentle Ben"?
Brother, you better have nerves of steel and be proficient in the use of that cannon. You are only going to get one shot.
If you are dead set on a revolver, I would suggest trying out a double action. Not as many steps for your system to complete once you have gone into full "Oh Crap" mode. I used to carry a S&W model 29 when I was in the woods (Been a while, I don't camp much anymore). Nowadays, it's a Glock G40 in 10mm. Never know when you might run into Gentle Ben's cousin- Tweaker Bob.

Just my opinion.

I guess I've been doing it wrong for the 40 years my walk about carry gun more often than not has been my Ruger Blackhawk in 45 Colt. Granted I shoot and carry a Ruger level load in it. I own a Redhawk 44 mag and it's my brush country hunting gun and a XD(m) in 10mm that gets shot when someone wants to see what 10mm is all about.

CLT65 · May 13, 2020

There's another forum I'm on where some of the old-timers routinely denigrate those who want to load their magnums to magnum levels. They say they download their .44 Mags and it's so much better, and all you're doing with high-velocity bullets is wasting powder and beating up your gun and your wrist. They claim that a 250gr bullet at 900-1000fps is all you'll ever need in a handgun, for almost anything.

I didn't say I agree, but it is an interesting perspective. The original heavy black powder load, using balloon-head brass and 40gr powder, would do 900fps with a 250gr bullet, in the 7 1/2" barrel. So the be-all and end-all for handgun performance was acheived almost 150 years ago?

The standard army load of later years was lighter than that, hence the specs for the .45 acp.

I've only been into .45 Colt for a few years now. I've been loading and shooting .44 Magnum for 30+ years. I've come to really appreciate the Colt and single actions. They can be a lot of fun.

oremike · May 13, 2020

I load 44 mag to 44 mag levels, a 300 gr bullet TC bullet runs 1300fps out of my 7 1/2" Redhawk.
My 45 Colt Blackhawk load is somewhat less and is a 255gr SWC running 1100fps out of 6 1/2" barrel.
The 45 Colt load I sell replicates the original black powder load with a 250gr or 200gr RNFP at about 900fps.
A Ruger level loads Max pressure is 29,000 PSI and a 44 Mags Max pressure is 36,000 psi.