How To Set Up A Trust For NFA

[wired]

So...if I understand this right, every NFA item would require a $200 stamp to move into a trust?

I'm not talking about new purchases, but ones that they already own and have a stamp for in their own name.

Yes. Each transfer to a trust would be like a fresh transfer and take $200 worth of tax.

 

[JedB]

Thanks for everyone that has contributed.
I'll be starting the process for a trust shortly.

 

[best defense]

I have just started the proceedure required to manufacture a suppressor. Can I send in the paperwork in the name of the trust instead of in my name, so I only need to do the $200 transfer tax one time? Right now I don't have a suppressor. The paper work is for the manufacture of one. Can it be manufactured in the name of the trust instead of my name?

 

[Abiqua]

I have just started the proceedure required to manufacture a suppressor. Can I send in the paperwork in the name of the trust instead of in my name, so I only need to do the $200 transfer tax one time? Right now I don't have a suppressor. The paper work is for the manufacture of one. Can it be manufactured in the name of the trust instead of my name?

Yes.

 

[bundyloco]

Using the willmaker language, do I start an individual trust and the successor trustees are able to have the nfa items? Or do I need to create a shared trust and name them as sharing the trust? Willmaker seems to only want to do a shared trust for husband and wife, but I would like to make my wife and father co-trustees.

 

[wired]

Using the willmaker language, do I start an individual trust and the successor trustees are able to have the nfa items? Or do I need to create a shared trust and name them as sharing the trust? Willmaker seems to only want to do a shared trust for husband and wife, but I would like to make my wife and father co-trustees.

Just do what willmaker tells you to do and at the end export the whole thing to word. Once you are in Word manually change the trustee info

 

[to the floor]

Boy I really missed the boat. I am one of those bloodsucking lawyers who spent 3 years in law school and another year getting an advanced degree in estate planning/wills and trusts. And I see a lot of gaps in the above advice. The devil is in the details boys.

 

[wired]

Typical lawyer. First post and "I'm a lawyer and theres all kinds of problems with the quicken trust but I'm not going to discuss what they are" BS post. It happens on every gun board.

For 90% of the people who really dont give a damn with their crap after they die and they just want goodies without a hassle, the quicken trust works just fine. Everyone who has used it has been approved. The forms just go into the Indiana Jomes warehouse after approval.

 

[to the floor]

Typical lawyer. First post and "I'm a lawyer and theres all kinds of problems with the quicken trust but I'm not going to discuss what they are" BS post. It happens on every gun board.

For 90% of the people who really dont give a damn with their crap after they die and they just want goodies without a hassle, the quicken trust works just fine. Everyone who has used it has been approved. The forms just go into the Indiana Jomes warehouse after approval.

I get tired of debating with gun trust know it alls. Do what you like I could care less... quicken tursts, wills and power of attorneys are crap in my opinion as they are often wrong and designed for 50 states no matter what the pull down menu says.

 

[New Daddy]

I get tired of debating with gun trust know it alls. Do what you like I could care less... quicken tursts, wills and power of attorneys are crap in my opinion as they are often wrong and designed for 50 states no matter what the pull down menu says.

This is nice. But here's the real deal. I spoke with an attorney about 3 weeks ago about setting up a Trust for an NFA item. He said, he'd get back to me... Still waiting.

So...

I called a different well known area attorney who "specializes" in NFA trusts who many people recommend. I get a message machine and I'm still waiting for the call back. No mistakes here - I've called twice on different days - I leave my name, phone number, and tell them what I want.

I'm sitting here, with the "free" SOT provided trust in hand.

Now, I'd appreciate if you'd tell me why I should wait to provide an attorney with my hard earned cash when they won't return my calls?

 

[wired]

I get tired of debating with gun trust know it alls. Do what you like I could care less... quicken tursts, wills and power of attorneys are crap in my opinion as they are often wrong and designed for 50 states no matter what the pull down menu says.

Ive done ten transfers on two trusts in two different states. My Oregon trust is completely different than my Washington trust. To be honest I could care less as long as Uncle Sugars revenuers don't care. They've approved everything Ive ever sent them. It makes no difference to me but I can assure you that when I die everyone knows who gets what. The trust is just a legal scam to get goodies. Its not that important to me as an estate planning tool.

 

[to the floor]

Do you prepare NFA trusts? If so, how much do you charge?

I do but I am not advertising here. I was just surfing the web to see what is out there and came across this thread. I am sorry other attorneys don't return their calls...that is just kind of rude. But I understand to some extent as I make 1 hours pay doing a trust that takes me longer then that to do. A trust is an estate planning device that ATF now uses as a pass to get NFA items. BUT what happens IF something happens like Obama gets another 4 years and tries to do away with our second amendment rights (big if there) Pretty easy to cry illegal trust to do away with someone's "goodies". And who is going to stand up for this small segment of the population...the NRA??? LOL Yeah I know I had a boating accident too.

 

[to the floor]

but I can assure you that when I die everyone knows who gets what.

I also do probates and I can assure you that when you die everyone is going to come forward with their hands out to get your stuff. Maybe not your NFA items but your stuff. I have seen it way to many times.

 

[wired]

I also do probates and I can assure you that when you die everyone is going to come forward with their hands out to get your stuff. Maybe not your NFA items but your stuff. I have seen it way to many times.

Sorry. Not my family. Tight nit in a way thats hard to describe to "outsiders" . When anyone dies theres a half dozen "enforcers" making sure wishes are honored. Lawyers have never entered the picture.

 

[to the floor]

Sorry. Not my family. Tight nit in a way thats hard to describe to "outsiders" . When anyone dies theres a half dozen "enforcers" making sure wishes are honored. Lawyers have never entered the picture.

Well just to set the record straight then, I'm a retired fireman first and an attorney second.

 

[Gunner3456]

I also do probates and I can assure you that when you die everyone is going to come forward with their hands out to get your stuff. Maybe not your NFA items but your stuff. I have seen it way to many times.

You don't probate trusts. That's one of the beauties of them. The trust owns the property and the trust never dies.

Now I don't believe you went to law school.

 

[to the floor]

You don't probate trusts. That's one of the beauties of them. The trust owns the property and the trust never dies.

Now I don't believe you went to law school.

Your joking right??? Trusts have pour over wills. In Washington you probate any property that is not on the schedule A. If you have a proper NFA trust only your NFA stuff is on the schedule A and thus in the trust and thus avoids probate...Unless you have another trust state law controls. You can also avoid probate in Washington if you have less then 100k and/or don't own real property.

 

[Gunner3456]

I'm not a lawyer. I'm seeing some things I'd like to clarify.

When you create a trust, you also make the schedule which describes what you are transferring to the trust. Once completed, the trust owns the items, not you, not the grantor and not any trustee. The trust itself is a "person" and it owns it.

You can amend the schedule to add or subtract things which the trust owns. That's how you "fund" the trust.

Once you create a trust named the "John Doe Joint Living Trust" it becomes a "person." You now can't change it by substantially re-writing it. If you do, you create another "person." I'm not being clear here, but you have to write an "Amendment to the John Doe Joint Living Trust dated (date of the original trust)" and have that notarized. In other words you don't rewrite the whole trust or you'll create a whole new trust which doesn't own anything. The first trust will own everything and the second trust by the same name will be a different "person" and will be unfunded. Amend with an amendment, don't rewrite the whole with the same name.

There is a grantor. That's the person(s) who own the items (or want to own them) and who wish to transfer ownership to a trust.

There is a trustee(s). That's the person who is in charge of the trust. That person(s) can buy, sell, transfer items belonging to the trust, and decide where they are domiciled.

There is a first and maybe even a second and/or third successor trustee. In order from the first down, they become the trustee if the original trustee can't serve due to incapacity, death, or voluntary resignation. The original trustee can resign simply by drawing a resignation form, signing and having it notarized. Then the first successor is now the trustee.

There is the beneficiary(s). Those are the "heirs." They can also be successor trustees. Or not.

At all times after forming and funding the trust, the trust owns the things on the schedule.

 

[Gunner3456]

Your joking right??? Trusts have pour over wills. In Washington you probate any property that is not on the schedule A. If you have a proper NFA trust only your NFA stuff is on the schedule A and thus in the trust and thus avoids probate...Unless you have another trust state law controls. You can also avoid probate in Washington if you have less then 100k and/or don't own real property.

A trust isn't required to have a pour over will!!! The only reason you'd want that is in case you forgot to put something on the trust's schedule. My 95 year old Dad has everything in a trust. We don't have a pour over will because we are positive that everything he owns is listed in the trust. He has one bank account, a home, a car, and household possessions.

You don't probate things in a trust because the trust doesn't die.

I still don't believe you went to law school.

 

[to the floor]

I'm not a lawyer. I'm seeing some things I'd like to clarify.

When you create a trust, you also make the schedule which describes what you are transferring to the trust. Once completed, the trust owns the items, not you, not the grantor and not any trustee. The trust itself is a "person" and it owns it. I can't remember if the trust is a person or an entity

You can amend the schedule to add or subtract things which the trust owns. Correct That's how you "fund" the trust. Yeah or you can fund the trust with a seperate bank account in the trust name

Once you create a trust named the "John Doe Joint Living Trust" it becomes a "person." or entity?? You now can't change it by substantially re-writing it. If you do, you create another "person." I'm not being clear here, but you have to write an "Amendment to the John Doe Joint Living Trust dated (date of the original trust)" and have that notarized. Yes you make an Amendment to the trust using the same name of the original trust and have it notorized and witnessed. In other words you don't rewrite the whole trust or you'll create a whole new trust which doesn't own anything. You don't create a second trust. The first trust will own everything and the second trust by the same name will be a different "person" and will be unfunded. Amend with an amendment, don't rewrite the whole with the same name.

There is a grantor. That's the person(s) who own the items (or want to own them) and who wish to transfer ownership to a trust.

There is a trustee(s). That's the person who is in charge of the trust. That person(s) can buy, sell, transfer items belonging to the trust, and decide where they are domiciled. yes but your form 4 determines where they are domiciled. Otherwise I believe you have to fill out another form with ATF to change locations.

There is a first and maybe even a second and/or third successor trustee. In order from the first down, they become the trustee if the original trustee can't serve due to incapacity, death, or voluntary resignation. The original trustee can resign simply by drawing a resignation form, signing and having it notarized. Then the first successor is now the trustee.

There is the beneficiary(s). Those are the "heirs." They can also be successor trustees. Or not. I believe so unless they are under 18 in WA

At all times after forming and funding the trust, the trust owns the things on the schedule...yep.

hope this works