Glock Bulged Cases

[DootyBeet]

I'm relatively new to reloading and have finished just over 3000 rounds of differing calibers. I now have a bunch of 9mm cartridges to reload which have been fired from a G26 and a G19.
I have noticed that the spent cartridges have a bulge near the bottom, just above the extractor groove. The re-sizing die does not travel that far down and cannot pull hte bulge back up.
From reading infomation about this, it turns out that glock barrels do not fully support the round which causes this problem.
I have read, from another forum, that a solution is to use a case roller which re-shapes the cartridge prior to going through the reloading re-sizing die. The problem is this machine that does this is very expensive! www.casepro100.com Over $ 750 when you get the required dies.
Does anyone here reload glock fired cases with another solution? Any options would be great as one can buy lots of new rounds or prepped brass for $ 750.
Thanks

Read More

 

[pencap]

I've reloaded A LOT of Glock cases.

It's not a problem.

Having said that, Redding makes a "G-Rx Sizing Die" specifically made to remove the buldge. It mounts in your single stage press and the cases are fed from the bottom and pressed all the way through the die to the top. There is a separately available adapter that will allow you to thread a 2-liter pop bottle on the top so you can press to your heart's content.

Midway has both.

Here's the sizer: http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=358543

Here's the adapter: http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=789703

Both of these are for .40 I'm not sure if they sell (or Redding makes) one for 9mm.

 

[NWPilgrim]

I reload a ton of brass for .40 and 9mm shot through Glocks and use Lee and RCBS dies with no problems. Perhaps the Lee Carbide Factory Crimp die helps, but I don't see a bulge either.

You can also try an aftermarket barrel for about $100.

 

[DootyBeet]

Both of these are for .40 I'm not sure if they sell (or Redding makes) one for 9mm.[/QUOTE]

Thanks. I've been searching Redding an cannot fund such for 9mm. After you run your .40 through this, I assume you still run through the usual re-sizing / de-capping die? Does this completely remove the bulge so you can use in a non-glock barrel?

 

[DootyBeet]

Update - I just talked to Redding in New York and they don't make this die for 9mm as they claim it won't work since the 9mm casing is slightly tapered. They did say they get this question quite often and would love to have a product for such.

 

[pencap]

Yeah I still resize as normal. It fully removes any bulge as the entire case is forced all the way through the die. I probably don't have to resize again but I do it anyway as I load on a Dillon 650 and I don't want to screw with my setup.

 

[DootyBeet]

Thanks for your help Pencap. I too use a 650XL. Bummer they don't make this die in 9mm.
I talked to someone else who said the bulge doesn't matter if you use in glock again. You'd have to label it as Glock practive rounds only.
They won't even load in my Sig, instantly gets stuck

 

[pencap]

No offense, but Sigs are not a typical handgun (and not in a good way either).

When I was a reserve deputy, all of us except one shot Glocks. There was one guy who shot a sig. It was a jammomatic. Very ammunition sensitive. I would say that if you are going to reload at all, then use a different handgun. Any other handgun no problem. Sig = problem

 

[Tilos]

Both of these are for .40 I'm not sure if they sell (or Redding makes) one for 9mm.

"Thanks. I've been searching Redding an cannot fund such for 9mm. After you run your .40 through this, I assume you still run through the usual re-sizing / de-capping die? Does this completely remove the bulge so you can use in a non-glock barrel?""

For 9mm you can use a 38 die for the guppy bulge, from a Glock.

That said, I've never seen a 9mm bulged, but I think this mysterious bulge may be from extremely hot re-loads to make some kind of power factor in one of the run/gun games.

DootyBeet, can you post a pic of the bulge??

Tilos

 

[Gunner3456]

The "unsupported case" issue with the Glock is a myth. All semi-autos have the same issue because they have a feed ramp that protrudes into the chamber.

Some of the very old Glocks have a larger unsupported area than the newer ones, but I'm here to tell you that the gun with the largest unsupported area that I've seen is a 1911 .45 ACP in any brand. (of course it develops lower pressures than 9mm and .40 S&W.)

If you are having serious case bulging, you shouldn't re-use the case. The round was loaded too hot OR it wasn't re-sized properly when reloaded before and/or didn't fully seat in the chamber. Please throw that case away, with any semi-auto.

I never see that bulge with factory loads; only reloads. That's a good place to start your detective work. Almost all of the "Ka-booms" associated with Glocks and other semi's are associated with reloads and give reloads a bad name.

That bulge you are seeing should be low, near the extractor groove, and should affect only part of the case. It should be shaped like the unsupported area and not, rather, go all around the case. If it goes all around the case, the case wasn't re-sized properly and didn't fully seat in the chamber, or you have a problem with the gun which is causing rounds not to seat. If the latter is the "case," (pun intended) then it should also do it with factory rounds. If that is the case you have a dangerous gun until that is fixed. Maybe your slide main spring is getting weak. I replace mine every 1,000 rounds.

Double, triple, and quadruple check your powder charge for the powder you're using. Do the same with your case lengths and your overall finished round lengths. A bullet which is too close to the barrel when fired can build dangerously high pressure.

Here is a composite pic I made up recently showing unsupported areas in a variety of guns. It shows an older and newer Glock, and several others. As you can see, the Glock isn't the only offender. Anyone is welcome to save and re-use this pic.

 

[DootyBeet]

Wow Gunner, excellent post - very informative.
I was led to believe it was only Glocks and now can see that's not the 'case' (Yes, pun intended.
These were not re-loads, but all different brands factory FMJ 115's - Also shot from different guns which tends to make me think it's not an over-pressure issue or a loose seating issue.
As far as posting a picture, the bulge is not easily visable, but definately shows up with the calipers. I think you're right Gunner, it appears it does not go all the way around the case when I rotate the caliper the reading increases then decreases.
My original clue of the problem was when I dropped the brass into a Dillion case guage. I then ran the case through the Dillion de-capping, re-sizing die and checked it again. - Same thing, not fitting corrrectly in the case guage. It's fine except for the last bit just before the extractor groove, as you mentioned in your post. I also, as mentioned before tried to cycle them in a Sig, which would not work.
Is it possible there's a better sizing die than the Dillion, which travels farther down the brass to remove such?
I also went and saw the Casepro 100 in action. Works fantastic but is very $$$. The owner has automated it with a motor and a Dillion case feeder and runs all his handgun brass through it.
But, back to economics - it would be cheaper to toss the spent brass and buy new.
Thanks again for the great responses.

 

[Arkitek]

I'm finding the same thing to be true Gunner...
During my last reloading of 100 .40sw, I had 5 rds bulging at the base of the case, very evenly all the way around...just fattening...not the pregnant type bulge from over pressure. They wouldnt clear my rd gage.
I load with a dillon 550b and called their tech line and asked what's up wid dat?..."they suggested its just a normal flaw in the 40sm case design...shows up there more often than other cases. Its caused by the fact resizing the case compresses it and squishes it downward...if the die is set as the paperwork says, its a bit too high to resize this bulge... he said screw it in until it makes contact with the shell plate then tighten it down...so it resizes the whole case." I also have a cheap Lee single stage, so I mounted my deprime/resize die on it and got a deeper resize...full length of case...looks nice and straight now!
I'll be testing to see if all goes well and if the bulge ever reappears...so far, so good. I currently load toward the max side of the speer/lyman/nosler load tables, but havent been exceeding the recommended max loads...so I know over pressuring my cases hasnt been the cause of the case base fattening.

If I should see the "GLOCK SMILE" type bulge on any of my cases, I'm throwing them away...thats a weekened case issue and I like my guns and my fingers!

Good topic...thanks for all the great discussion men!
Keep Shooting and reloading...UR!

 

[Gunner3456]

. he said screw it in until it makes contact with the shell plate then tighten it down...so it resizes the whole case." I also have a cheap Lee single stage, so I mounted my deprime/resize die on it and got a deeper resize...full length of case...looks nice and straight now!

That's it!

If I should see the "GLOCK SMILE" type bulge on any of my cases, I'm throwing them away...thats a weekened case issue and I like my guns and my fingers!

That's it! If you get a bulge it has severely weakened the metal and must not be reused, no matter the brand of gun.

 

[Gunner3456]

Wow Gunner, excellent post - very informative.
I was led to believe it was only Glocks and now can see that's not the 'case' (Yes, pun intended.
These were not re-loads, but all different brands factory FMJ 115's - Also shot from different guns which tends to make me think it's not an over-pressure issue or a loose seating issue.
As far as posting a picture, the bulge is not easily visable, but definately shows up with the calipers. I think you're right Gunner, it appears it does not go all the way around the case when I rotate the caliper the reading increases then decreases.
My original clue of the problem was when I dropped the brass into a Dillion case guage. I then ran the case through the Dillion de-capping, re-sizing die and checked it again. - Same thing, not fitting corrrectly in the case guage. It's fine except for the last bit just before the extractor groove, as you mentioned in your post. I also, as mentioned before tried to cycle them in a Sig, which would not work.
Is it possible there's a better sizing die than the Dillion, which travels farther down the brass to remove such?
I also went and saw the Casepro 100 in action. Works fantastic but is very $$$. The owner has automated it with a motor and a Dillion case feeder and runs all his handgun brass through it.
But, back to economics - it would be cheaper to toss the spent brass and buy new.
Thanks again for the great responses.

Welcome. I'd read Arkitek's post and follow that. I don't have any trouble getting cases straight with Lee dies, but I'll never re-use a case with a real bulge or "smiley" as they are called, or a bulge all the way around, no matter what brand of gun was used.

 

[Tilos]

Gunner3456:

Thanks for the pictures and everyone else for the input.
I've seen that bulge in 40sw action range brass but never in 9mm.
I've heard it called the guppy bulge, pregnant case, and now Glock smile.

I use a Storm Lake 9mm barrel in a G23 and that gives me some extra wall thickness and less chance of a KB.
For a $100 barrel and 9mm magazine...another gun.
AND it shoots lead bullets (accurately).

No need for me to "make" stock class or power factor as I just "plink" so my loads are mild.

Thanks again for the info, Tilos

 

[Gunner3456]

OK, please understand that I in no way intended to imply that the Glock barrel is bad or dangerous. I meant to imply the opposite. Remember, most LEO depts in the country use them in .40 without problems.

I do think that improperly inspected/reloaded rounds in any gun, especially an autoloader could be dangerous because they all have that unsupported ramped area. We've all seen YouTube vids of all kinds of guns including strong bolt action rifles blowing up.

I'm not at all afraid of my reloads but I'm really careful how I build them and what I use to do it, for any gun.

Be safe.

 

[Gunner3456]

Gunner3456:

Thanks for the pictures and everyone else for the input.
I've seen that bulge in 40sw action range brass but never in 9mm.
I've heard it called the guppy bulge, pregnant case, and now Glock smile.

Uh, no. "Smiley" no matter the brand, LOL. I'm busy defending my Glock here.

I've seen that same smile from other brands, too, and other brands go KaBoom with bad reloads.

 

[Tilos]

I bought a Glock early on, before aftermarket barrels were around, and tried everything to get it to shoot groups with lead bullets.
Lead bullets never worked and that Glock was relagated to a carry gun and hardly ever went to the range.
I want my guns to shoot better than me, so when I miss I know it's me...not the gun.
That "old" glock (stock barrel) would shoot basket ball size groups with lead bullets at best.

LEO shoot a lot were I shoot now and leave massive amounts of 40 brass on the ground.
Some of it is still loaded!! I think from jam clearing drills.

Unless someone is reloading with Wolf primers, I consider range mushrooms I find with a brass colored primer as once fired.
Generally, all reloads have nickel colored primers.

As I stated before, I suspect the bulged 40sw range mushrooms I find are reloads of some sort and never intended to mean it was the gun.

Also, any gun that has extreme barrel leading will bulge cases from the extra pressure.

The Glock I have now, with a traditionally rifled after market barrel and properly sized bullets, shoots way better than me and goes to the range a lot.

Tilos

 

[Arkitek]

Sorry all...Guess I feel little compelled to clarify my comments on my last post...I am a Glock owner as of recent and the "Glock Smile" has'nt showed up on anything I reload or shoot...but the net is full of references like that and I kinda like those tag-lines...but I also feel strongly that Glock makes a fine firearm...I guess, I'm kinda excited (almost like a little girl) hoping...but...still waiting for my own Glock Smiling Experience! Between you and me...I'm gettin less excited as I wait. Maybe we should call the "myth-busters" in on this one!

Some are Sensitive...but so are I ...U R still !
Keep shooting...it keeps us RE-loading!

P.S...By the way Gunner...I shot my Crony today...How did that happen...you say?
Yes...I am so ashamed...!
Shiny...must have been cause its Shiny...or maybe the sun was in my eyes...yea...that's the ticket...the sun!
Did you see it?

OKAY...Truthfully...I really shot it THREE times...!!! And I liked it!!!! Dang...that rod flies far!

Back to the Garage to reload and straighten my RODS...Take care guys! Have fun out there

 

[Gunner3456]

I bought a Glock early on, before aftermarket barrels were around, and tried everything to get it to shoot groups with lead bullets.
Lead bullets never worked and that Glock was relagated to a carry gun and hardly ever went to the range.
I want my guns to shoot better than me, so when I miss I know it's me...not the gun.
That "old" glock (stock barrel) would shoot basket ball size groups with lead bullets at best.

LEO shoot a lot were I shoot now and leave massive amounts of 40 brass on the ground.
Some of it is still loaded!! I think from jam clearing drills.

Unless someone is reloading with Wolf primers, I consider range mushrooms I find with a brass colored primer as once fired.
Generally, all reloads have nickel colored primers.

As I stated before, I suspect the bulged 40sw range mushrooms I find are reloads of some sort and never intended to mean it was the gun.

Also, any gun that has extreme barrel leading will bulge cases from the extra pressure.

The Glock I have now, with a traditionally rifled after market barrel and properly sized bullets, shoots way better than me and goes to the range a lot.

Tilos

Sorry all...Guess I feel little compelled to clarify my comments on my last post...I am a Glock owner as of recent and the "Glock Smile" has'nt showed up on anything I reload or shoot...but the net is full of references like that and I kinda like those tag-lines...but I also feel strongly that Glock makes a fine firearm...I guess, I'm kinda excited (almost like a little girl) hoping...but...still waiting for my own Glock Smiling Experience! Between you and me...I'm gettin less excited as I wait. Maybe we should call the "myth-busters" in on this one!

Some are Sensitive...but so are I ...U R still !
Keep shooting...it keeps us RE-loading!

P.S...By the way Gunner...I shot my Crony today...How did that happen...you say?
Yes...I am so ashamed...!
Shiny...must have been cause its Shiny...or maybe the sun was in my eyes...yea...that's the ticket...the sun!
Did you see it?

OKAY...Truthfully...I really shot it THREE times...!!! And I liked it!!!! Dang...that rod flies far!

Back to the Garage to reload and straighten my RODS...Take care guys! Have fun out there

Nice posts guys, and good info. Yes, the Glock has a mico-grooved barrel and isn't made for lead bullets and yes, you can get an aftermaket barrel which will quickly pay for itself (about $100 for a Wolff) if you cast your own lead.

I'm actually pretty new to Glocks and have a G23. I bought a Glock because so many LEO's have them including a couple of my relatives. I did my own homework before making my decision. I'd be the last to say it's the best gun out there but it's a good gun and affordable.

As for shooting your chrony Arkitek, you know what they say. There are only two kinds of chrony owners. Those who have shot them, and those who are going to shoot them. I have a brand new spare set of rods and diffusers. I think they cost $7.50 or something at Midway.com.

Tilos, I'm glad to hear you haven't had a smiley. The case is made to withstand the pressure in all semi-autos. I can't find any reputable references to serious smileys or kabooms with factory ammo. It's all reloads that I find, so let's be careful out there, no matter what we load. We can blow up anything if we aren't careful.

Cliff