ATF Shenanigans (a gripe session)

[lucusloc]

So the ATF has gotten me grumpy again. I have a form 1 SBR I am waiting to build out. It is a Century Arms AP5-M, which is a Turkish (MKE) clone of the MP5k. The forms are being filed through Silencer Shop. I had them all filled out, with "i"s dotted and "t"s crossed, and submitted a month ago. Earlier this week I got a denial, and the reason give is "ZENITH IS THE IMPORTER, MKE IN TURKEY IS THE MANUFACTURER." This despite the clear "Century Arms" roll marked on the side of the firearm (submitted in photos with the application) and the fact that Zenith has not been the importer since 2020, has started local production of MP5 clones and has a lawsuit with MKE over that fact.

Gee whiz guys, aren't you supposed to be on top of all this? I figured it out in 10 minutes as I was researching which MP5 clones were worth getting.

After a little chat with Silencer Shop they said I could challenge the denial on account of it being absolutely incorrect, but that that might take longer than just resubmitting a new application with different information in the "manufacturer and/or importer" field. I told them I absolutely will not falsify the paperwork (as per the ATF directions to correct) and put "Zenith" as the importer, as I do not want to be running around with a tax stamp for a "Zenith" firearm when the one in my hand is roll marked as "Century Arms." I compromised and went with entering the original manufacturer (MKE) but even there I am less comfortable as "MKE" is only part of the "model name" and if I get some overzealous and ignorant LEO who wants to "check my paperwork" I have to count on them being able to connect the dots instead of just read a roll mark and compare it to the stamp.

This whole situation has me rather less confident that I will not be able to get into trouble with this firearm despite all the effort I went through to get the stamp correct.

We just need to burn the whole NFA down. I thought I was going to be able to avoid most of these shenanigans because I actually like the length of pull I get from a brace, but a.) I want to put a VFG on this firearm, and b.) the wife actually likes the inch or two extra we get from a full stock. This probably means we are going to wind up with a whole lot more SBRs as she decides she likes one of my "pistols" or another and wants me to make it a bit more comfortable for her. I guess the game to be played is "how big an NFA inventory can we get?"

Anyway, I got the mail that the new paperwork is ready to be filed with the ATF. Guess I will go submit that and wait to see what happens. Wish me luck.

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[Nosferatu]

the wife actually likes the inch or two extra

There's the crutch of the whole problem right there.

 

[PrDubi]

Just put what they ask and under comments, put down the extra stuff.

They denied my SBR as they want it to say Colt M4-A1 nevermind that my roll mark says
M4A1 Carbine
Cal 5.56 MM

You need to be in touch with the examiner who did it and they can approve it quickly.

Mines was denied at 7am pacific standard time, I was in an email and call with mines, Carol Ripley, and by 9am PST my new one was approved after the correction.
I got my refunds quickly also.

 

[lucusloc]

Just put what they ask and under comments, put down the extra stuff.

They denied my SBR as they want it to say Colt M4-A1 nevermind that my roll mark says
M4A1 Carbine
Cal 5.56 MM

You need to be in touch with the examiner who did it and they can approve it quickly.

Mines was denied at 7am pacific standard time, I was in an email and call with mines, Carol Ripley, and by 9am PST my new one was approved after the correction.
I got my refunds quickly also.

The auto forms stuff does not list the examiner who did the review unfortunately. We would have to file a complaint/challenge to the denial and wait for it to work through official channels.

What irks me the most is that I submitted photos that clearly show the roll mark, and you would think that would be a rather big tipoff to whoever was doing the review that maybe they did not have the complete picture. I highly suspect they never bothered to check though, they just thought they knew and issued the denial before even looking at page 2.

 

[PrDubi]

If you added an email and your phone number, that kinda makes it easier.

My denial was in March and like I said, mines called me and we worked together to correct it.

 

[L84Cabo]

So the ATF

Well there's your problem son!


If you are expecting intelligence and/or competency from any governmental agency, you will be severely disappointed. And out of all the grossly incompetent governmental agencies, the ATF is at the top of the list. We seriously need to ban them. Maybe Trump will when he gets in office again but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

Anyway, I hope your update goes through this time. I will say a little prayer to the gun gods to hopefully bestow some positive juju on your form.

Good luck! And may the odds be ever in your favor!

 

[lucusloc]

Well there's your problem son!


If you are expecting intelligence and/or competency from any governmental agency, you will be severely disappointed. And out of all the grossly incompetent governmental agencies, the ATF is at the top of the list. We seriously need to ban them. Maybe Trump will when he gets in office again but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

Anyway, I hope your update goes through this time. I will say a little prayer to the gun gods to hopefully bestow some positive juju on your form.

Good luck! And may the odds be ever in your favor!

Thanks. If they give me more grief about manufacturers or importers I am just going to staple both forms together and tell them to pick one. I will never submit a form on this gun that lists Zenith anywhere on it, no matter how much they whine.