Thread: Camouflaging your food stores

Originally Posted by cyborg

Ok so we have taken all the time and trouble to collect our food stores. Now we have to keep them from being taken by intruders into our storage area. Of course burying your stores or building false walls to hide it behind would be ideal but what about when that is not possible? What about when your boxes or buckets will be in places that will certainly be seen eventually? What are some ideas for camouflaging the nature of your stores?

For example, you could put on a label that suggests that your buckets are a poisonous corrosive or possibly something useless to the intruder like family photos. I know a pile of 30 5 gallon buckets of "Corrosives" in your garage would look odd as well as "Buckets" of family photos. What are some strategies for misleading intruders so they are repelled by or lose interest in your stash? Ideas?

Cache them and bug-out. If you are worried about raiders, then what makes you think any amount of hiding is going to help? Once they smell you cooking your food- it's over...no mater how well hidden it is.

Originally Posted by cyborg

Ok so we have taken all the time and trouble to collect our food stores. Now we have to keep them from being taken by intruders into our storage area. Of course burying your stores or building false walls to hide it behind would be ideal but what about when that is not possible? What about when your boxes or buckets will be in places that will certainly be seen eventually? What are some ideas for camouflaging the nature of your stores?

For example, you could put on a label that suggests that your buckets are a poisonous corrosive or possibly something useless to the intruder like family photos. I know a pile of 30 5 gallon buckets of "Corrosives" in your garage would look odd as well as "Buckets" of family photos. What are some strategies for misleading intruders so they are repelled by or lose interest in your stash? Ideas?

That's a bad example, and that's not camouflage.

What are these circumstance where your food storages will "certainly be seen eventually"? Are you leaving them on your front porch?

My favorite camo-storage I've seen was a few of those rubbermade tubs covered with about ~3 yards of gravel in someones back yard.
Nobody is going to mess with your gravel pile, and unless you're digging in it, you'd never know there were things stored underneath.

I've got it in the basement and there is so much accumulated goods, err, trash, down there that I'm just hoping if the day ever comes that I need it, I can find it myself.

Originally Posted by cbzdel

i would think your best bet would be to store in crawl space or attic space.. maybe not the best location but thinking as a looter I would not think of crawling under a house, especially if you tuck it away on the opposite end of the crawl space..

If you can think of it, so can a looter!

The best idea i've read on this thread so far is the burying it 3 feet under gravel....

But seriously the best defense is a solid offense.....stock up on the ammo & always leave someone to guard your food stocks

Originally Posted by freeman3911

The best idea i've read on this thread so far is the burying it 3 feet under gravel....

But seriously the best defense is a solid offense.....stock up on the ammo & always leave someone to guard your food stocks

Cool, sounds like we finally have this problem solved.

Next!

Lefty.

I agree, the solution is not to leave your house undefended. Hiding your food is not important if you can defend your house.

I still think disguising is important. During the great depression, people were jailed for food hoarding. Raiders aren't the only folks who may be looking for food. I'd wouldn't put it past our friends at DHS to stop by to make sure we don't have more food than everybody else. after all, that wouldn't be fair. If you're purchasing all this food with a card, they already have a paper trail to follow.

Live far enough away from people that they won't be coming by for a visit. It's a lot easier.

Originally Posted by billcoe

I've got it in the basement and there is so much accumulated goods, err, trash, down there that I'm just hoping if the day ever comes that I need it, I can find it myself.

sounds like my house.

You could label some of the buckets as "Primer" and some as "Paint". (especially if you can print up some labels)

Originally Posted by gearhead

I still think disguising is important. During the great depression, people were jailed for food hoarding. Raiders aren't the only folks who may be looking for food. I'd wouldn't put it past our friends at DHS to stop by to make sure we don't have more food than everybody else. after all, that wouldn't be fair. If you're purchasing all this food with a card, they already have a paper trail to follow.

I know that the government has violated people's rights before, but that would be a violation of the 4th amendment.

Yes, but in an "emergency" you don't think the gubmint will make food "hoarding" a crime?

Think like your enemy...

If I was a raider...
Do you really think labeling a bunch of buckets "paint" or "Clinton bubblegum" is going to stop me from opening them? If you truly want to conceal them, I would make hidden walls or bury them before I printed out ingenious labels.

If I was the government...
Anyone that didn't obey my every law would have their valuables confiscated for the greater good. Too much violence? Take away all the guns. Not enough food? Go take some from someone who has it in stock. Justify your actions under some Martial Law pretext about needing to "maintain civil order" and all that crap.

What people fail to realize is that a SHTF senario already happened in the United States- KATRINA.

You have stories of people going door to door with machetes in hand looking for suplies...houses with lights still on, generators running or stories of people holding out with supplies were their first stops. Then you have the black SUVs rolling in with the big three letters (ATF, DHS, FBI, take your pick) proning people at gun point because they saw a rifle being loaded in a truck- then they took their guns, loaded them in a conex and locked them up. Add that to how many "questionable" police shooting that are beginning to still barely see the light of day and you get to realize that even the police will execute their own brand of justice to "win back the streets".

Katrina tells us many lessons:

#1. People are out for themselves. If it is their best interest to take your supplies (especially if their is no LEO presence) they will take it...by force if necessary. After all, it's "survival of the fitest" and all that.
#2. Having all the supplies but no way to defend them puts you in a worse possition than if you have no supplies at all.
#3. Having all the guns but no supplies makes you a raider.
#4. In the absence of order, expect chaos...ALWAYS.
#5. The government will do anything they feel necessary to maintain order...regardless of your "rights" or your legal activity. Then when it's all said and done they will deny, deny and deny...then point fingers to direct your blame elsewhere.

Originally Posted by Riot

Think like your enemy...

If I was a raider...
Do you really think labeling a bunch of buckets "paint" or "Clinton bubblegum" is going to stop me from opening them? If you truly want to conceal them, I would make hidden walls or bury them before I printed out ingenious labels.

If I was the government...
Anyone that didn't obey my every law would have their valuables confiscated for the greater good. Too much violence? Take away all the guns. Not enough food? Go take some from someone who has it in stock. Justify your actions under some Martial Law pretext about needing to "maintain civil order" and all that crap.

What people fail to realize is that a SHTF senario already happened in the United States- KATRINA.

You have stories of people going door to door with machetes in hand looking for suplies...houses with lights still on, generators running or stories of people holding out with supplies were their first stops. Then you have the black SUVs rolling in with the big three letters (ATF, DHS, FBI, take your pick) proning people at gun point because they saw a rifle being loaded in a truck- then they took their guns, loaded them in a conex and locked them up. Add that to how many "questionable" police shooting that are beginning to still barely see the light of day and you get to realize that even the police will execute their own brand of justice to "win back the streets".

Katrina tells us many lessons:

#1. People are out for themselves. If it is their best interest to take your supplies (especially if their is no LEO presence) they will take it...by force if necessary. After all, it's "survival of the fitest" and all that.
#2. Having all the supplies but no way to defend them puts you in a worse possition than if you have no supplies at all.
#3. Having all the guns but no supplies makes you a raider.
#4. In the absence of order, expect chaos...ALWAYS.
#5. The government will do anything they feel necessary to maintain order...regardless of your "rights" or your legal activity. Then when it's all said and done they will deny, deny and deny...then point fingers to direct your blame elsewhere.

Sadly this sounds about right to me...

-d

Originally Posted by Riot

Think like your enemy...

If I was a raider...
Do you really think labeling a bunch of buckets "paint" or "Clinton bubblegum" is going to stop me from opening them? If you truly want to conceal them, I would make hidden walls or bury them before I printed out ingenious labels.

If I was the government...
Anyone that didn't obey my every law would have their valuables confiscated for the greater good. Too much violence? Take away all the guns. Not enough food? Go take some from someone who has it in stock. Justify your actions under some Martial Law pretext about needing to "maintain civil order" and all that crap.

What people fail to realize is that a SHTF senario already happened in the United States- KATRINA.

You have stories of people going door to door with machetes in hand looking for suplies...houses with lights still on, generators running or stories of people holding out with supplies were their first stops. Then you have the black SUVs rolling in with the big three letters (ATF, DHS, FBI, take your pick) proning people at gun point because they saw a rifle being loaded in a truck- then they took their guns, loaded them in a conex and locked them up. Add that to how many "questionable" police shooting that are beginning to still barely see the light of day and you get to realize that even the police will execute their own brand of justice to "win back the streets".

Katrina tells us many lessons:

#1. People are out for themselves. If it is their best interest to take your supplies (especially if their is no LEO presence) they will take it...by force if necessary. After all, it's "survival of the fitest" and all that.
#2. Having all the supplies but no way to defend them puts you in a worse possition than if you have no supplies at all.
#3. Having all the guns but no supplies makes you a raider.
#4. In the absence of order, expect chaos...ALWAYS.
#5. The government will do anything they feel necessary to maintain order...regardless of your "rights" or your legal activity. Then when it's all said and done they will deny, deny and deny...then point fingers to direct your blame elsewhere.

Actually the only stories I've heard is of local New Orleans police (know to be one of the most corrupt in the nation) and maybe the National Guard confiscating firearms. Remember, the people in Louisiana were bubbleguming about a lack of FEDERAL response (ATF, FBI DHS are all federal).

I don't see the Feds getting into a gestapo mode unless it is a nation wide SHTF. If that happens they and other government agencies would be the least of your worries. Besides Katrina, you can use the Rodney King LA riots as an example. There was a whole lot of looting and destruction going on, and if you recall the only people whose stores were left unharmed were those owned by Asian immigrants who posted armed guards on the rooftops.

If there is a complete collapse of society you'd better hope to have some land way out and know how to farm.

Originally Posted by Grunwald

I know that the government has violated people's rights before, but that would be a violation of the 4th amendment.

yeah, it would. do you really think that would stop them? remember this? Bush and Lincoln both Suspended Habeas Corpus as far as i'm concerned, almost every gun law is a violation of the second amendment. trampling our rights is nothing new.

double that

Originally Posted by Grunwald

Actually the only stories I've heard is of local New Orleans police (know to be one of the most corrupt in the nation) and maybe the National Guard confiscating firearms. Remember, the people in Louisiana were bubbleguming about a lack of FEDERAL response (ATF, FBI DHS are all federal).

I don't see the Feds getting into a gestapo mode unless it is a nation wide SHTF. If that happens they and other government agencies would be the least of your worries. Besides Katrina, you can use the Rodney King LA riots as an example. There was a whole lot of looting and destruction going on, and if you recall the only people whose stores were left unharmed were those owned by Asian immigrants who posted armed guards on the rooftops.

If there is a complete collapse of society you'd better hope to have some land way out and know how to farm.

American handgunner did a story on a woman who had her firearms taken away at gunpoint from a group of black suited, black SUV types. Claimed they were under orders to confiscate all firearms.

Also, you have to realize that the majority of the Louisiana National Guard never deployed to Katrina...they were already overseas at the time. What you had was a mix of regular Army (some in my unit in the 82nd included, but not my specific platoon) and some from the nearby units. They were all under a CONUS command structure...given EXPLICIT orders not to engage or even draw on people unless they felt that their lives or the lives of others were in immenant danger. They did, however, get orders to detain anyone caught looting.

The NOPD were too busy getting into their own shootouts, rescuing people off rooftops and dealing with their own shotcommings (many of the NOPD officers simply abandoned their posts [taking the patrol cars with them] or simply became apart of the looting themselves). They didn't have the resources to go door to door confiscating firearms.

Nevertheless, what few feds that were deployed during the aftermath began patrolling the streets, confiscating firearms from anyone they found on the way.

Knowing that this was a violation of constitutional rights...nobody ever owned up and outright stated that they ever confiscated firearms (despite have storages full of guns). Everyone took advantage of the confusion and chaos. The feds blamed the Army, the Army blamed the local PD, the local PD blamed the feds...but still, to this day, nobody claims a single gun grab.




Sure, it looks bad with NOPD holding the bag...but it was the feds (for the most part) that filled it.

YouTube - Hurricane Katrina Firearms Confiscation

Are these not NOPD?


YouTube - National Guard Confiscating Guns in New Orleans
again Police and National Guard



There is a reason why we called the No Goes when I was in the Army.

Truth is that all these agencies were violating the Constitution in a major way. The 2nd and the 4th amendment were trampled upon and the New Orleans Chief of Police should be in jail for his part. All the NG officers involved should be court marshaled for executing illegal orders (they have an obligation to refuse illegal orders).

First: mis-labeling things is not a good idea. Especially labeling it with a poison label. You do not ever want to give your kids the idea that they can eat something that has a poison label on it.

Second, the only reason to hide something is if you're going to leave it undefended. I wouldn't necessarily *advertise* that you have a lot of preps, but in ordinary times, no one is going to break in to steal 5 gallon buckets of wheat. It's not like leaving the box from your new xbox outside at Xmas.For a regular break-in, meth-heads are looking for something they can pawn or sell on the street.

Not that many people come to my house and spend time in my garage to know what I have in there. Some of my neighbours know I have firearms because they'll occasionally see us heading in and out for family day at the range, and a long gun is kind of obvious.

All that said, I can see stashing some guns, ammo, and maybe some silver or gold coins somewhere out of the way in a hidden cache, as an ouside chance sort of insurance. But not my buckets of wheat.

Someone is home at my house most of the time, and I've made a point of getting to know my neighbours a bit. My next door neighbour is disabled and is literally home all the time.I've indicated my intent to be the good neighbour in any emergency, let them know my cell number to call me, etc. They like having a military vet next door, with big dogs and guns. The guns are in a safe, large enough to not tempt anyone to try to move it.

In a really bad emergency where bugging in at home doesn't make sense, I'll be loading up and taking my stuff to my sister's mother in law's house a bit further out of the city, at least until I get my own retreat built. I would feel pretty stupid with my emergency supplies under 3 feet of gravel if I were injured during the event (earthquake, storm, whatever.) I'm not moving hundreds of pounds of gravel with a broken arm or leg.

I don't think I've heard of people being arrested for hoarding during the Depression. I'd have to see a credible source on that.

Confiscation and looting are a risk in any emergency, but confiscation of supplies will probably target companies before they try to get to individual homes, and you'll see that coming. Confiscation of firearms is possible, but probably not in any organized fashion if the emergency hits abruptly, and if it gets to an organized effort, it's time to have those firearms to hand, not under a mound of gravel.

If the BATFE-I-E-I-O shows up with a warrant, they're almost certainly going to find what they're looking for. They'll have metal detectors and they have more institutional experience of finding hidden firearms than any of us have at hiding them.

If you're in an urban area when something like that happens, you're probably screwed no matter what. As for looters, most of them are not looking for a fight either. I would keep in mind the difference between scavenging and looting.