Let's Change Washington State's Silencer Laws

mxitman · Jan 22, 2009

This is from Carnaby and others from another forum just trying to get the ball rolling again.

I've contacted <broken link removed> and my own Senator without much luck. We need more support to get this done please pass this on.

As many of you know, Washington State has strange laws regarding ownership and usage of firearm sound suppressors, also known in lay terms as "silencers."

Currently, if we follow federal law, we are allowed by Washington State law to own sound suppressors (which I'll simply refer to as "suppressors" from here forward). We may also mount them on functional firearms. However, and here's the strange part, we may not actually fire any bullets through them. This is according to RCW 9.41.250(1)(c).

You might start by inquiring with Senator Hargrove about the legislation he proposed to get this changed a few years back, and why it didn't go through. Here's his contact info:

<broken link removed>

And info relating to the bill with regards to changing restrictions on firearm noise suppressors, which he introduced in 2005: It didn't get very far, maybe we can bring it back.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/Summ...5167&year=2005

which would have amended RCW 9.41.250 to read:

(3) Uses any contrivance or device for suppressing the noise of any
firearm unless the suppressor is legally registered and possessed in
accordance with federal law, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.

Yeah, it's a stupid law the way things stand. At least you can get one here, though you've gotta at least as far as Oregon or Idaho to legally use it.

Lets Get it Done!

BTW I was thinking of making some shirts with that picture on it!

JumpWing · Jan 22, 2009

"Silence is Golden."

ZeroRing · Jan 24, 2009

Loud firearms OK, loud pipes on my ATV... NOT OK!!! :nuts:

Doc In UPlace · Jan 24, 2009

Who has a Senator who isn't an idiot? Ours is Rosa Franklin, Leg. District 29, not a good choice for sponsorship.

Once you meet with a open-minded sponsor the rest goes pretty easily.

If we could emphasize how it could make/save some bucks for Washington we'd be speaking their language.

mxitman · Jan 24, 2009

Who has a Senator who isn't an idiot? Ours is Rosa Franklin, Leg. District 29, not a good choice for sponsorship.

Once you meet with a open-minded sponsor the rest goes pretty easily.

If we could emphasize how it could make/save some bucks for Washington we'd be speaking their language.

Yeah I was thinking along the same lines. I'm in the 1st Leg District and have met and talked with <broken link removed> my Representative about some issues but haven't talked to him since the election. He used to be the Chief of Police for the city of Bothell. I'm not sure his stance on this issue though. I wrote to him in October about it but he never got back to me. I think Senator Hargrove's plan to change the language is the most simplest.

S-0056.1 _____________________________________________
SENATE BILL 5167
_____________________________________________
State of Washington 59th Legislature 2005 Regular Session
By Senator Hargrove
Read first time 01/17/2005. Referred to Committee on Judiciary. AN ACT Relating to firearm noise suppressors; and amending RCW 9.41.250. BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF WASHINGTON: Sec. 1. RCW 9.41.250 and 1994 sp.s. c 7 s 424 are each amended to read as follows: Every person who: (1) Manufactures, sells, or disposes of or possesses any instrument or weapon of the kind usually known as slung shot, sand club, or metal knuckles, or spring blade knife, or any knife the blade of which is automatically released by a spring mechanism or other mechanical device, or any knife having a blade which opens, or falls, or is ejected into position by the force of gravity, or by an outward, downward, or centrifugal thrust or movement; (2) Furtively carries with intent to conceal any dagger, dirk, pistol, or other dangerous weapon; or (3) Uses any contrivance or device for suppressing the noise of any firearm unless the suppressor is legally registered and possessed in p. 1 SB 5167 accordance with federal law, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.
--- END ---
SB 5167

As long as you were able to purchase and own a silencer you could use it! It would still punish those who do so illegally. I think that's the best option.

I'm not a big fan of taxing people or adding any more taxes onto us but I think some language that would work would be to change the line to read;

Uses any contrivance or device for suppressing the noise of any firearm unless the suppressor is legally registered and possessed by a Washington State concealed pistol license holder under chapter RCW 9.41.070 in accordance with federal law, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.

This way you have to go through a background check, any of us who already have a CPL are good to go and it takes care of allot of legal issues with age etc. Plus the big bonus for the state would be the Fee's they collect for the CPL. along with every other agency who gets part of the fee's. I would think there would be a huge increase in those applying for CPL's so everyone wins, this state is way over budget so we would be helping them out. I'm sure there will be some people who won't like the idea of requiring the CPL to get a silencer but it's a good start and it's better than nothing!

What do you guys think... should I run for office?....lol

You can find your Legislator here, it's a good place to start.

Doc In UPlace · Jan 24, 2009

Just had a thought, with not much editing effort an amendment could specifically allow LEO agencies the use of them, too. This aspect might juice up the motivation for action.

Seems like there is no such provision for LEO use right now in RCW 9.41.250, they just are refraining from arresting themselves, which is not an ideal situation.

I need to think about the money aspect of this for awhile.

ZeroRing · Jan 24, 2009

You know, I think you've hit on probably THE best way to make this happen! Convince the "lawmakers" that as it stands now any LEO's that use them are technically committing a crime if they train with them.

Therefore, since the law needs to be changed to "allow" LEO's to train with them "legally", it seems that allowing law abiding citizens the use of them as well makes sense too (especially since we can already "legally" own them).

I would think a "common sense" Rep or Senator who is pro second amendment would see the logic in "fixing" this poorly worded existing law.

Worth a try at least! :s0155:

mxitman · Jan 27, 2009

I plan on contacting my Rep about this and seeing what he has to say. Being an ex LEO he should have a good background on the LEA handling of this issue.

I'll keep you guys updated!

mxitman · Jan 27, 2009

whoa... it's on the move....http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2009-10/Pdf/Bills/House%20Bills/1604.pdf

see this post here.

mxitman · Jan 27, 2009

I just sent this letter to my 1st District Representative Mark Ericks, If anyone wants to use part of it, please go ahead just omit what doesn't apply to you!

Lets get it done!

Dear Mr.Ericks,

Hello my name is Rick ******* and I'm a member of Local 32 Plumbers and Pipefitters Union. We recently met this last fall when you came down to the local 32 political fair we had at our union hall. I was writing to you in support of House Bill 1604. (Changing restrictions on firearm noise suppressors.)

I like many other Washington residents who enjoy Hunting and Shooting Sports feel we have always been archaic in our state laws regarding the use of firearm suppressors. We are allowed to own them but not use them.

Even exposure to 85dBA of noise causes hearing loss over time. Though target shooters seldom are without earplugs, hunters often do not wear ear protection because they need to hear the sounds of the environment around them. Safety is always the utmost concern when handling and shooting a firearm, its very hard to communicate with other shooters and children when wearing traditional hearing protection. Allowing legal use of suppressors would be a net health benefit to shooters, hunters and the public.

Shooting ranges, even those situated out in the country, often are a source of noise pollution. Instead, we should stand behind our environmental principles and make it easier for target sports enthusiasts to be good community members by reducing noise pollution.

I'm also concerned that Law Enforcement Officers could be at risk if this doesn't pass. The "exemptions" for Law Enforcement Officers applies only to section 9.41.250(1)(a) regarding knives. The "exemption" does NOT apply to silencers addressed in 9.41.250(1)(c).

So as I understand it, if a Law Enforcement Officers is training with suppressors it would appear that they are in violation of 9.41.250(1)(c) and are "guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW."

I hope you can help me in supporting this bill and look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

Rick *********

mxitman · Jan 27, 2009

here is another letter;

HB 1604

Hello,
I would like to ask for your support of House Bill 1604 "Changing restrictions on firearm noise suppressors". The original law was poorly written and has restricted lawful owners of suppressors from being able to actually use them in the state of Washington. This is to include Law enforcement agencies (as there is no provision in the law to allow them to use suppressors).

Many law abiding citizens and law enforcement agencies would like to use suppressors in order to decrease the chance of hearing damage to themselves and those around them. Many gun ranges, to include the Tacoma Rifle and revolver club, are located in areas with residences nearby. I imagine the use of suppressors would also be appreciated by these residents as well.

Thank you for your consideration and your service.

Also a revision to mine to make in more concise and simpler to read;

Hello,

I would like to ask your support of House Bill 1604 "Changing restrictions on firearm noise suppressors."

I like many other Washington residents who enjoy Hunting and Shooting Sports feel we have always been archaic in our state laws regarding the use of firearm suppressors. We are allowed to own them but not use them.

Even exposure to 85dBA of noise causes hearing loss over time. Though target shooters seldom are without earplugs, hunters often do not wear ear protection because they need to hear the sounds of the environment around them. Safety is always the utmost concern when handling and shooting a firearm, its very hard to communicate with other shooters and children when wearing traditional hearing protection. Allowing legal use of suppressors would be a net health benefit to shooters, hunters and the public.

The exemptions for Law Enforcement Officers applies only to section 9.41.250(1)(a) regarding knives. The exemption does NOT apply to silencers addressed in 9.41.250(1)(c).

If a Law Enforcement Officer is training with suppressors they are in violation of 9.41.250(1)(c) and are guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.

I hope you can help me in supporting this bill and look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

mxitman · Feb 15, 2009

Update; I have received a few return emails in regards to my letters I just got this one recently;

Thank you for including me in your e-mail to Rep. Ericks.. HB 1604 is currently a house bill. It has been sent to House Judiciary Committee, however, it has not been scheduled for a hearing. If it passes through House committees and a vote on the floor it will then move to the Senate. I will keep your thoughts in mind and watch for the debate if it arrives on the Senate floor. I always appreciate hearing from my neighbors in the first district. Thank you again for your thoughts!
Rosemary McAuliffe

wichaka · Feb 15, 2009

I contacted John Wasberg of the Attorney Generals office in Wa. State. He does all the criminal law updates for LEO's etc.

He said the law as we read it pertains to individuals, not entities. Meaning a person can not use one, but a Gov. agency or entity is exempt as it's not an individual person.

So then I threw at him, that a group such as (for example) XYZ Rifle club purchases a suppressor. It's not an individual purchase or use, but a group.

He's researching it...

mxitman · Feb 15, 2009

Great work :s0155:

wichaka · Feb 16, 2009

Update,

Talked with Wasberg this morning, in further review there's no written exception for LE use, or group either.

Definition of "person" can be found in RCW 1.16.080

He mentioned that Auburn P.D. has lobbied for a bill adding the exemption for LE use.

He will be emailing a copy fo the proposed bill, and I will post it here when i get it.

He also mentioned that it would be hard pressed to find a P/A that would prosecute the law as it stands today, as LEO's are using them. If the LE exception is added, then you would most likely see prosecution for it.

Hopefully the whole law will be lifted, and will mirror Oregon.

Stay tuned...

ZeroRing · Feb 16, 2009

Thanks for the updates and the efforts in follow up!! :s0155:

Doc In UPlace · Feb 16, 2009

I sure can't wait to be the one to try this out. Oh yeah. :s0114:

I'd bet you anything you like that within 24 hours of anyone of us showing up at a public range with a can on there, we'd be in jail faster'n you can say habeus corpus.

it would be hard pressed to find a P/A that would prosecute the law as it stands today

I don't have the kind of defense money to try that theory out, and I'd lose my PI license in the process.

But thanks for the commo and update. We need to keep the cards and letters going. In my experience a phone call, followed by a Fax is the most effective.

mxitman · Mar 4, 2009

nothing new on my end, anyone else hear anything?

SonicBlue03 · Mar 10, 2009

Is there a thread or sticky to keep track of things like this, as well as all other current legislation?

mxitman · Mar 11, 2009

Bad News... Just got this update from my Rep;Mark Ericks, Looks like we need to try again.

Thank you for your email in support of House Bill 1604. This bill died in committee and will not progress further this session. It will have another chance when we reconvene next year.

Again, thank you for taking the time to share your position with me.

-Mark

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Let's Change Washington State's Silencer Laws

mxitman

JumpWing

ZeroRing

Doc In UPlace

mxitman

Doc In UPlace

ZeroRing

mxitman

mxitman

mxitman

mxitman

mxitman

wichaka

mxitman

wichaka

ZeroRing

Doc In UPlace

mxitman

SonicBlue03

mxitman

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